This practice is unbelievably common. This is likely to favor specific individuals they wanted to hire who happened to be foreign, not to favor foreigners per se.
this post was submitted on 10 Nov 2023
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That is 0.025% of their 2022 net profit, so basically nothing
They got off light. As always.
yeah missing a few zeros at the end.
Apple should be fined 25 billion? Why?
Because only then would the fine have any power.
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Sadly, IMO, the U.S. is not producing grads with the skills and work ethic needed for today’s STEM jobs, which is why Apple pursued this strategy in the first place.
As a hiring manager, it’s hard to find anyone from the U.S. who actually treats their job like a job. Entitlement is rampant.
Once again. This is a nationwide problem. Everywhere is outsourcing
Apple likes to give tons of money and employment to genocidal dictatorships like China
Apple powers chinas current massive military expansion which could be used to kill Americans among many others
Saudi Arabia and Qatar don’t count as genocidal dictatorships?
We Americans are super close friends with
Saudi Arabia 🇸🇦 and
Qatar 🇶🇦
Or the easiest example, the US throws hundreds of billions of dollars in aid and military support to Israel, which is actively committing genocide right now and killing journalists to cover it up.
When you can’t legally own slaves, import them!
The "slaves" in question here are being compensated between 160K-220K base salary, and 250K-350K total comp.
via the southern border.
They hire foreign workers because they are much better workers and a lot smarter
This is delusional. They hire these workers because they’re on work visas and basically have to tolerate whatever bullshit Apple throws at them because if they quit or get fired they’re going back to their home country
while getting paid 200-500k or higher total compensation a year
Now sue the other companies doing the same, Google, JPMorgan Chase
Apple probably has $25 million in loose change between couch cushions at their HQ.
These fines for apple is less than a speeding ticket for us
These fines for apple is less than a speeding ticket for us
I remember hearing that one of the Scandinavian countries has speeding tickets denominated as a fraction of your annual income so a billionaire speeding ticket still hurts. I could be hallucinating though -- too lazy to google it.
Slap on the wrist. All big tech companies have been basically on-shoring for the last 10 years
jobs going to lowest bidder gives shoddy quality, but deportation threats get work done.
Apple made 96 billion last year or $182,650 a minute just about.
They paid this fine in 2.3 hours.
Think about what qualified people lost when they literally can’t work for these companies. Literal pennies in fines that they have to pay.
It should be something that will genuinely hurt their bottom line. Like in a clear case of malice and trying to skirt the law like that? A guilty verdict should carry a fine of 30% of all revenue, not profit, for the [fiscal] year.
No accounting tricks and barely slap on the risk fines. A fine that risks profitability to the shareholders they are (supposedly) accountable to. Executives wouldn't touch a program like what just pulled with a 10 foot pole.
"You think too much of me, kid. I am not that clever. All I want is a truce." - The Federal Government
Yep, having Apple on your resume can change your whole life. Not to mention the highly competitive salaries for even moderately technical positions.
$25 million is nothing. Thats probably what they make in a days worth of sales, probably even less than a day. This is pocket change for a corporation of their size. They probably knew what the fines would be and decided it was cheaper to pay that than do the right thing. Hell, corporations allocate part of their budgets for fines and penalties; it’s an incidental part of doing business for them.
Someone did the math in the comment below yours. Roughly 2 & 1/3 hours of sales
Well I’ll be damned. My estimate was way off.
Why pay for local talent when you can hire overseas visa slaves and abuse them. You save a ton of money and they have to work like dogs to be able to stay in the country.
You do not save any money as you cannot pay them less than residents for the same position/ work.
What you get is: One, they usually have the talent they want to bring identified already n(someone who works at Apple in India, for instance)
Two, they get some stability because on those visas it is harder to hop jobs (used to be almost impossible, now it is just harder). But frankly, with Apple in your resume it is not that hard at all.
Those "slaves" are being paid 200K-500K total comp, more as they get promoted. There are plenty of local engineers and developers willing to work a lot of hours for that much - this isn't a race to the bottom for extra work or lower pay, it's literally a skill issue.
Those overseas hires are making the same as a local. They’re targeting the best foreign talent, this isn’t about saving on labor costs.
“ The $25 million payment includes $18.25 million in back pay for those discriminated against and $6.75 million in fines.”
How are they going to identify people who were discriminated against when they could not even apply in the first place?
This is an old tactic to drive wages down.
A bunch of the major tech companies did this in the 90s
This does not drive wages down. Legally, H1B/Perm applicants need to be paid identical compensation to US-hired resources, and Apple is legally mandated to report the offers they make to anyone granted a visa under the program.
Tech companies love the H1B process because sponsored employees can't simply quit, or they lose their visa. In most cases, they also love it because the employees they're bringing in are not new hires, they're overseas employees that are a known quantity.
Just because that's what the law is supposed to do doesn't mean it is actually effective. They might hire a US Engineer with a Bachelors degree, while hiring an H1B who did a Bachelors in India, worked for IBM India for 3 years, came to the US and did 2 years for their Masters degree . Then they both have the job title "Software Engineer IC2" so technically they can pay them the same. But the cutoff for promotion from IC2 to IC3 is entirely arbitrary so the government can't regulate it. But they get someone with 5 additional years of career investment at the same price.
The equivalent of me being fined 25 cents
I am from the UK, applied to apple US and was instant rejected due to not being from the US. This news doesn’t match my experience.
We call that a Texas penny.
I’m getting ready to graduate and was looking for an internship. My friend who’s already graduated had some friends at other companies and was asking around on my behalf to see if they had any internal postings. Of the 4 people he’s asked 3 of the were currently only hiring either a gay person or minorities. Kinda seems fucked up.
Absolute bullshit.
I call BS on that. i've been in a hiring position at several large companies and the first thing they tell you is NEVER ask about age, religion, sexual orientation, etc. It's very much against the law.
Nobody in their right mind would ever say out loud "sorry we're only hiring gays or minorities for this position". Even if that's what's happening behind the scenes, you absolutely can't admit it publicly. If you can find a place that has done so, report them to the feds. They're in big trouble.
Why did they do it though?
Breaking news: Foreign labor is cheap.
Breaking news. Foreign labor is cheap when is foreign. In the US (legal) "foreign" labor costs exactly the same as local labor.
Apple was built using the programs America put in place to make businesses thrive on the back of taxpayers. Hire Americans first. Period.
It's part of the inclusion.
Now do the rest of Silicon Valley. Cheaper to sponsor a visa than hire a citizen.
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