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The absolute worst thing we can do is settle for a neoliberal.
Because if we do, and they win the general, they get to install cro ies in the DNC after the election.
We need AOC regardless of if she thinks she's ready, sometimes you just gotta jump out of that plane.
They will do just what they did to Sanders. DNC will not allow AOC to be the nominee.
Then it's time for a new party.
You might be right, they might block her. I've been shocked at how much they are willing to protect themselves from Progressives, but that's not why Bernie never got the nomination. Bernie never got the a Democratic nomination because he's NOT a Democrat.
Bernie is an Independent, and has always been a staunch Independent. He may caucus with the Dems, but he doesn't fundraise for them, he doesn't share his campaign money with them, he doesn't support them. Over the decades, he has been nearly as critical of Democrats as he was of Republicans.
The Presidential nomination is the greatest gift a party can bestow upon a party member, and they are going to give it to a loyal member who has worked hard for the party, NOT an outsider who is just hijacking the party's infrastructure to use it to ride to victory, and support policies that the party doesn't support.
Bernie wasn't nominated because he wasn't a Democrat. AOC is a loyal Democrat, and if she gets the primary votes, and the DNC still won't nominate her, then that's the end of the Democratic Party. Dems shouldn't be so worried about that, the Republican Party died about a decade ago, and became the MAGA Party. It happens, parties die, and new ones pop up.
The party rewarded Leiberman with a VP nod. He wasn't a member of the party either, but I guess he returned the favor by blocking the public option for them.
Or we'll see you come up with a new excuse for the party ignoring its own rules again.
First of all, VP isn't president. Also, Lieberman had been a Democrat for most of his career, except the very end when he turned Independent, so maybe there was some dumb Democratic idea that this would bring him back to the fold.
In any case, it didn't work, and they lost the race, in part because many Democratic voters weren't thrilled with Lieberman, whom many saw as a turncoat for leaving the Dems and going independent. So choosing an independent certainly didn't inspire the Dems to ignore their rules in the future.
What an ignorant statement....
They once financed a Republican in order to beat a Democratic nominee because they were progressive. Jist look at the New York Mayor race if you need an example of how the DNC would treat AOC.
The party fights progressives and not republicans.
Maybe learn about something before you comment on it?
It's an ignorant statement, because it ignores how much has changed since the January DNC chair...
They didn't know about that.
The comment is ignorant.
Next time ask if you don't understand something, most of the time I'd have blocked you first instead of replying.
Yeah, since they got their brand new chair who has instantly fixed everything just as long as you don't actually look at what the party is doing, they've ousted David Hogg and tried to force through cuomo in a primary.
Sanders and Noam Fucking Chomsky himself started spouting neo-liberalism bullshit, and AOC just voted against stripping funding to Israel from 2026 "defense" act.
They ain't the heros you're looking for.
Yes they are. No candidate is perfect, and they are far better than any of the others.
Don't let perfect stand in the way of good.
Centrists, call us when you find these "good" candidates who can win a majority of a vote, and until then sit down and let us handle cleaning up your mess, without your constant yammering.
Thats about the least you could do to help at this point, so do that.
What’s your plan for cleaning up the mess? Let me know how I can help!!
We haven't gotten to cleaning the mess yet. Your mess, we're in it now.
You all insisted on voting for a non viable right wing candidate and she lost. The numbers have been out long enough for you to make a correct conclusion: people didn't vote for Trump over Kamala, they just rejected fascism-light from the Democrats and stayed home.
Liberals love slogans like "Believe in science," "Love is love," or "Black Lives Matter." But these mantras are pasted onto a system that jails Black and brown youth at staggering rates, exports death through drone strikes and sanctions, and props up apartheid regimes like Israel with billions in aid. Kamala Harris, as California’s "Top Cop," made a name for herself by locking up poor people, defending death row convictions tainted by misconduct, and laughing off truancy policies that disproportionately harmed working-class families. She literally argued in court that the state would "lose a source of cheap labor" if incarcerated people were released early. And yet, liberals who marched under banners reading "ACAB" in 2020 did backflips to justify their support for her.
Why? Because identity politics, stripped of any materialist critique, has become the liberal religion. It's a shallow representation game: so long as a candidate checks certain demographic boxes, they’re granted moral immunity from the violence they enact. A woman bombing Yemen is better than a man bombing Yemen, apparently. A Black VP rubber-stamping military aid to Israel is a milestone of inclusion, even as Gaza burns.
And here lies the grotesque irony. Liberals chant about systemic racism, but refuse to confront the systemic violence upheld by the very leaders they support. They denounce ICE, but back an administration that continues deportations and funds border militarization. They wave rainbow flags while voting for a VP who until recently held archaic positions on same-sex marriage. They scream about reproductive rights, but ignore how imperial policies abroad strip countless peoples of even the right to live.
Real leftist politics demands we dismantle the structures that Kamala Harris has spent her entire career fortifying. It requires we see through the illusion of liberal "progress" and recognize that the carceral state, imperial hegemony, and racial capitalism do not become humane just because a woman of color is in charge of them. That’s not justice.
We'll clean up the mess, but it's gonna get messier first. You can choose to join us in cleaning up the mess, or you can waste your energy fighting on behalf of Gavin Newsom or whichever unpopular objective piece of shit the DNC forces down your throat next time.
I don't think anyone will read that, but I did. The thing is, you're not really wrong. But you aren't going to appeal to anyone like that.
Do you just want to be angry? Do you just want to yell? I feel that.
Personally, yes, I would rather have had non-Trump than Trump. There weren't really any other viable options besides Kamala when I voted. No third party vote would've saved us, even if I convinced literally everyone I know to do the same. But Kamala was much better than Trump, and you brought up good reasons why. She can be bullied into being better. Heck, Gavin Newsom can be bullied into being better. I don't really like either of them, but I have limits to what I can affect, and I chose that which I could.
Unfortunately, it's everyone's mess. We all have to clean it up. I didn't cause it. Heck, even people that don't live here probably have to help, and they're the least to blame for it. But, that's kinda how it works. Start small, and go from there.
not elect any more zionists for starters, and elminate any dem reps taking checks from them. Ocne we start taking out the trash of the bad dems, they will udnerstand they work for us and start kissin our ass instead of donors.
Fuck your good that includes making sure your children are wage slaves while your taxes slaughter children in Palestine. That's not good, you just don't give a fuck that the people YOUR TAX DOLLARS slaughter for your comfort are far away.
Who’s your perfect candidate? If there’s someone better I’ll happily back them.
There is no perfect candidate because both parties are actively fighting progressivism. What you do is hold your nose and vote for the one who won't try to eradicate anyone they don't like from the country and then show up to your local democratic party/club every meeting they have and be actively pissed off at the lack of progressivism. Bitching on the internet does nothing, trying to argue about the best candidate does even less.
Make it known what you want in your community and build a coalition in agreement
I agree. I’d just like to hear from the poster above if there’s a single politician that meets their standards, or are they just giving up and using this line of argumentation to justify their own lack of action.
Spoken like someone who is happy with the status quo. Whats your set of ideas champ, since you are all throwing these stones, lets see your answers, beyond sitting on your rear?
Go ahead. You do this to everyone else, lets hear your ideas.
Of course I’m not happy with the status quo. I plan to vote in the primary for the candidate who best matches my own values. I don’t know who that is yet.
All I’m seeing in this thread is arguments why we shouldn’t vote for this person or that, and not a single person willing to say there’s a candidate good enough that they’d bother to vote. I just want a fucking example of what good enough is. I’d vote for AOC or Bernie despite their flaws, but I’d love to have even better candidates to choose from.
You can't elect a perfect candidate from two fascist parties. Step one is to realize you don't owe them a vote, and they must give you a viable candidate before you give them your vote.
The Democrats are not your friends, you're letting them ruin the world and describing it as good.
I’m doing nothing of the sort. All I’m doing is asking you for an example of a candidate you think is worth voting for. Doesn’t need to be a democrat. Just anyone.
I think it’s hilarious when people like Jennings believe there will be another general election in which they’re allowed to vote. Lemmy is full of these dummies. Like, you had your chance and you failed to act because you fell for red herrings.
Telling people they won't be able to vote again helps no one but the far right trying to normalize the idea of a Trump dictatorship.
Meanwhile Republicans are preparing for the midterms.
Nominating AOC or Sanders would be equivalent to the Democratic Party conceding the election to the Republican Party. The chance of either winning a presidential election is functionally close to nill.
Sanders already would have won in 2016 if he hadn't been railroaded by the DNC. A ton of people went to Trump because of that.
Bruh, Hillary Clinton managed to win the popular vote in 2016. Sanders or AOC are not automatically disqualified from forming a winning coalition in light of that.
"Just go left and you'll automatically win 😊" idiocy from people on Lemmy is incorrect, but "Leftists can never win, no matter what!" is fucking stupid as well.