this post was submitted on 09 Nov 2023
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The poll found 50% of Democrats approve of how Biden has navigated the conflict while 46% disapprove — and the two groups diverge substantially in their views of U.S. support for Israel. Biden’s support on the issue among Democrats is down slightly from August, as an AP-NORC poll conducted then found that 57% of Democrats approved of his handling of the conflict and 40% disapproved.

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[–] archomrade@midwest.social 28 points 2 years ago (10 children)

I said this a week ago and got downvoted to hell, but I'll say it again: this issue will fuck him next November

[–] njm1314@lemmy.world 25 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Its possible, but how smooth brained would someone have to be to vote for Trump over this?

[–] roboticide@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Many just won't vote.

Which is still absolutely absurd, because any Democrat who doesn't vote for Biden is implicitly granting his Republican opponent a vote. This opponent may be Trump, but even if it isn't, it's still a Republican whose position on Israel and the conflict will make Biden's response look measured.

Many people are angered by Biden's response, but for pro-Palestinian supporters it's cutting off your nose to spite your face to not vote this cycle for Biden. You're actively allowing an even worse option.

[–] havokdj@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

To go against voting is to go against democracy itself. It blows my mind that democrats don't want to vote when republicans will.

[–] roboticide@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Democrats can be really dumb sometimes. Too many would rather stick to idealistic principles because at least then when they lose they can claim the high road and a persecution complex.

Maybe it's not much of a "complex" when that persecution actually then happens (like the Dobbs decision), but if Democrats would just shut up and vote with the best option available instead of not voting at all, maybe we'd win more. Trump wouldn't have been elected in 2016 if Democrats had turned out in the same numbers they did in 2008 but instead 4 million Dems just didn't show up.

If Democrats won more, we could at least start to implement changes like Instant-Runoff Voting or doing away with the Electoral College. Republicans don't want any of those changes, because they know it weakens their position. But so many liberals just refuse to vote because there's no "good" option and refuse to vote for the option that even enables a "good" choice, while any conservative will do anything they can to vote for anyone willing to put an (R) next to their name. It's so fucking juvenile and I'm still ashamed to admit I once used to believe it too.

[–] havokdj@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago

Don't get me wrong, both the AOC and the GOP are pure evil and there are both good and terrible people in those organizations, but when people say that "a vote is a waste" it makes my sight turn red.

The only reason not to vote is if no candidate has even a single policy that you agree with, otherwise, vote ffs.

And another thing, the voting mentality of the states is the reason we are stuck in a duopoly here. If someone truly does not want to vote for either party, at the very least vote for a third option so that party may potentially get seats and actually partake in the next election. As I said, the only way to waste a vote is precisely to not vote, and all a party needs to get seats is 5% of the popular vote.

[–] holycrap@lemm.ee 1 points 2 years ago

I hope we can get someone better in the primary

[–] OccamsTeapot@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

As much as the democrats want to believe this, it isn't the only alternative. Maybe it will just make some people stay home on election day

[–] Fades@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If so, that’s fucking ridiculous. Jesus fucking Christ democracy will die because Joe Biden didn’t force Israel to stop their genocide and only told them to stop instead????

Fuck this goddamn retarded existence just fucking kill me already Jesus fucking Christ

FUCK THIS GODDAMN PLANET

[–] GiddyGap@lemm.ee 8 points 2 years ago (1 children)

How?

The vast majority of American Jews are Democrats and seem to be supporting Biden's response.

Most pro-palestinian Democrats know that the Republican Party will not advance their cause in any way and not voting will only support the Republican Party.

[–] someguy3@lemmy.ca 7 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

There's outrage but when people think about what Trump would do... Geezus. Trump would declare war on the whole Middle East.

The question is will this event get the Republican voters out and keep Democrats voters home? Just for them to regret their protest non-vote again.

[–] PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee 1 points 2 years ago

Considering that the protest non voters have responded to Dobbs by answering criticism over it with "Well I wasn't pandered to enough!" and "Rights are a fiction anyways!"

[–] RagingRobot@lemmy.world 5 points 2 years ago

The other guy has a much worse record though and he's counting on that.

What I think will happen is trump will go to jail then the Republicans will pick someone else like Nikki Haley and Biden will be in trouble. I don't like her but she's much more palatable than Trump so she may have a chance.

[–] cupcakezealot@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 2 years ago

i mean what do you want him to do? any action through the un would likely be vetoed by uk or france, he has no control over the israeli military, the media has taken the propaganda hook line and sinker, and congress controls monetary relief (unless you want him to withhold aid which has been apportioned for relief already which is exactly what trump did that got him (rightfully) impeached).

[–] stewsters@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Yeah. And it would have been this way no matter if he did nothing, attacked Hamas directly, or bombed Israel.

The conflicts in the Middle East is very devisive. Folks have been fighting over that area since before we have written history. No matter what you do someone is going to want you dead.

I think his approach of guarding without direct invasion is probably the right one, but neither side will be happy with it.

[–] archomrade@midwest.social 1 points 2 years ago

Yup.

People seem to think I'm saying he's made the wrong choice and he'll loose because of it, but really I'm speaking very broadly.

What I think is unique to him in this election is his target voters. His caucus is significantly more progressive than they were even 12 years ago, which is why his whole message thus far has been 'the most progressive president of a generation'. And the Palestinian conflict in particular has seen a huge swing in sentiment. It used to be that the Democrats could reliably run a pro-israel campaign and their base would at least tolerate it, but that's not the case now.

The Republican base could not be more different, and honestly I think someone like Trump could campaign on even an anti-zionist position and not loose much support.

That the conflict flaired now is a disaster for him, because there is no way to handle it that will net him more votes. In particular, Biden would never be the one to change what has been the American diplomatic position for the last 70 years. And I think Netanyahu knows this, and will press the issue well into 2024 to rally support for his own goals.

[–] joker125@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

It won't but I like to remind actual voters to stop being complacent.

[–] Yeller_king@reddthat.com 1 points 2 years ago

I doubt international affairs affect many votes at all unless it's something that involves significant deployment of American soldiers.

Voters really only care about the things they think affect them.

[–] JoeHill@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

“Progressives” will elect Donald “Muslim Ban” Trump then. Morons.