this post was submitted on 10 Aug 2023
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My holy trinity of trust (lemmy.ml)
submitted 2 years ago by sgtnasty@lemmy.ml to c/memes@lemmy.ml
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The inner circle so to speak

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[–] dingus@lemmy.ml 97 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (5 children)

The thing is, ownership of any of these can change at any time. Bitwarden, Mullvad, and Tutanota could be sold to very different owners.

That is up to and including something like uBlock Origin, which only has one developer, and would suddenly be very different if that developer died and the project had to be forked.

You can never trust that the person who takes on the reigns has the same ideals as the people running them now.

Hell, Mullvad was abused to the point they removed access to Port Forwarding on their VPN service, which has led to many people needing to switch to crummier, shadier VPNs that still offer port forwarding access. That's not Mullvad's fault, but it is an example of them having to change their philosophy and what they offer because of abuse.

Trust should only go so far, and loss of trust should be very easy. There's not a good reason to keep "trusting" something when it has fundamentally changed from its initial ideals.

[–] r00ty@kbin.life 22 points 2 years ago

Hell, Mullvad was abused to the point they removed access to Port Forwarding on their VPN service, which has led to many people needing to switch to crummier, shadier VPNs that still offer port forwarding access. That’s not Mullvad’s fault, but it is an example of them having to change their philosophy and what they offer because of abuse.

It's a real shame too. It was a nice feature.

[–] Rayspekt@kbin.social 9 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Hell, Mullvad was abused to the point they removed access to Port Forwarding on their VPN service, which has led to many people needing to switch to crummier, shadier VPNs that still offer port forwarding access.

Could you explain what happened?

[–] dingus@lemmy.ml 25 points 2 years ago

As clear as I can make it out, it seems like it was related to a search warrant that was executed on Mullvad.

https://mullvad.net/en/blog/2023/4/20/mullvad-vpn-was-subject-to-a-search-warrant-customer-data-not-compromised/

Because just a little over a month after the news of the failed raid, there was news of them removing port forwarding.

https://mullvad.net/en/blog/2023/5/29/removing-the-support-for-forwarded-ports/

Emphasis mine.

Unfortunately port forwarding also allows avenues for abuse, which in some cases can result in a far worse experience for the majority of our users. Regrettably individuals have frequently used this feature to host undesirable content and malicious services from ports that are forwarded from our VPN servers. This has led to law enforcement contacting us, our IPs getting blacklisted, and hosting providers cancelling us.

The result is that it affects the majority of our users negatively, because they cannot use our service without having services being blocked.

The abuse vector of port forwarding has caught up with us, and today we announce the discontinuation of support for port forwarding. This means that if you are a user of forwarded ports, you will not be able to add or modify the ports you have in use.

[–] apt_install_coffee@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 years ago

They made a smart call that has probably increased the long term privacy of their users.

People were using port forwarding to host illegal shit, and governments were getting pissed off about it. Mullvad has been able to prove in court that they don't keep logs, but that's not a perfect deterrent; a properly motivated government, perhaps if somebody is using Mullvad to host CSAM, might attempt to legally force Mullvad to put logging in and add anti-canary clauses.

Preventing port forwarding keeps customers as consumers rather than hosters, and avoids this issue.

[–] Galli@hexbear.net 7 points 2 years ago

This is true and people should always be mindful of this. Additionally you should consider not just the ownership of the companies but also the infrastructure they rely on such as their rented servers, payment processors, on-site staff etc. However commercial VPNs remain a convenient compromise for many use cases. These services are probably fine for your shitposing needs but should not be relied upon for activism for instance.

[–] SIGSEGV@waveform.social 6 points 2 years ago

Same thing just happened with IVPN :⁠-⁠\

[–] machiabelly@hexbear.net 3 points 2 years ago

I used to use proton until I saw them give info for a warrant. After that I gave up on the VPN thing. If I lived in a country with limited streaming options I might use them but shrug-outta-hecks

[–] Qkall@lemmy.ml 48 points 2 years ago (1 children)

bruh, i can't be the only one confused why state farm's drive safe app was being touted...

[–] Udonezo@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

allows their car insurance to spy on their location data and driving habits Is curious about privacy

Okay buddy

[–] Fazoo@lemmy.ml 25 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Why do you trust a Germany based secure email over something like Proton? At least Mullvad is Sweden based.

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[–] whileloop@lemmy.world 18 points 2 years ago

KeePass is also a good password manager, it's open source and you get to store the password database anywhere you like.

[–] DarkwinDuck@feddit.de 14 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I have bitwarden and mullvad, but what's the other one?

[–] marcus@lemmy.world 13 points 2 years ago

It’s Tutanota, an email service

[–] Mr_1077@monero.town 7 points 2 years ago (3 children)

For anyone still using Mullvad and wants port-forwarding, I recommend AzireVPN.

Good list! I use all of them too.

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[–] gvasco@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I might swap bitwarden by passbolt as it uses a more recent programming stack, although vaultwarden looks to be a good alternative too.

[–] fox@hexbear.net 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Does a more recent stack translate to any real benefits?

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[–] rambos@lemm.ee 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I trust bitwarden, but android app doesnt trust me!

[–] Samsy@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That mole is sus to me, I am more like into Snakedragons.

[–] sgtnasty@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 years ago

Snakedragons

I heard it was a mythical creature

[–] LesbianLiberty@hexbear.net 3 points 2 years ago (3 children)

What's bottom right? Top is Bitwarden and Left is Mullvad VPN

[–] johnbrownwasright@hexbear.net 3 points 2 years ago

that's Tutanota

[–] ahornsirup@artemis.camp 2 points 2 years ago

Tutanota, an email service.

[–] blobcat@kbin.social 2 points 2 years ago

tutanota, an email service

[–] sabreW4K3@lemmy.tf 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

tutanota is terrible though

[–] twei@feddit.de 12 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Tutanota is one of the few good E-Mail services that i can think of, what's so terrible about tutanota?

[–] sabreW4K3@lemmy.tf 2 points 2 years ago

The lock in and the lies. The first being your inability to read your emails in another client. Second is the lie that it's secure when email is inherently not second. It's making a false promise.

Oh and I forgot the new issue, being that you can't zoom mail, which is infuriating.

Disclaimer: I pay for Tutanota and have for a few years. But I'm tired of it. Will switch to another season once K-9 becomes Thunderbird for Android

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