this post was submitted on 08 Nov 2023
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With QBs that have retired in the last 5 years, there are some interesting HOF debates that I see coming up. Right now the sure-fire HOF guys are Brady, Brees, and Rodgers when he retires. The next tier, however, is a lot more interesting. You have Matt Ryan, Big Ben, and Rivers who are all very close. What's interesting is that according to Pro Football Reference's HOF Monitor, they all have fairly similar scores even though they have different resumes. Ryan has the MVP/All-Pro 1 season which is pretty much required unless you have 2 Super Bowls. Ben doesn't have a crazy MVP season, but he does have those 2 Super Bowls and 17 good years. Then Rivers has some crazy counting stats. I think that Ryan and Roethlisberger have a slight edge over Rivers but it is very hard to separate the 3. So my question is do we think any of them make it? If they do it opens up the debate for a lot of players in the future. Also, how do we think the HOF committee weighs Rings/MVPS/All-Pro teams? The media is always so focused on the rings but looking at the resumes of HOF QBs there are a lot more without rings than there are without All-Pro seasons.

Edit: Here is the PFR Monitor. The average HOF QB has a score of 108. Ryan has a score of 106, Ben has a score of 100, and Rivers is at 98.

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[–] mr_showboat@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (12 children)

I think Ben gets in. I think Matty Ice does not. I am genuinely not sure about Rivers.

[–] Kentuxx@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

It’s Super Bowl wins, it’s as simple as that. Ben gets in bc he won and the others didn’t. It’s the difference of Goff vs Stafford on the rams. Stafford is a hall of fame QB, Goff as of now is not. Barring injuries, Goff is setup to have a similar career to Ryan and Rivers.

[–] michaelb421@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I think rivers gets in but it will take a bit. Matt Ryan is a no. I don’t feel like Matt Ryan should be in. He was decent. Big Ben will only get in due to his rings and because he played for the Steelers.

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[–] sliccricc83@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Where is Stafford ranked?

[–] SerDire@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben is a lock. Matt Ryan will take some time but I feel like he’ll make it eventually. That MVP greatly helps push him over the line, I feel like

[–] Aerolithe_Lion@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Brady - yes

Rodgers - yes

Brees - yes

Roethlisberger - yes

Manning #3 - yes

Rivers - 50/50, but probably eventually yes

Ryan - no

Mcnabb - no

Romo - no

Smith - no

Wilson - 50/50, but probably eventually yes

Luck - no

Cousins - no

Stafford - unlikely but plausible

[–] doonterdoo@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I feel like the line has to be Stafford

[–] xshogunx13@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ryan MIGHT get in, because of the MVP, Ben almost certainly will unless they hold the rape against him (they should), Rivers shouldn't because of lack of accolades or playoff success.

[–] Mr__Otter@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I feel like Matt Ryan is a good litmus test for future HOF potential for QBs.

Above -> gets in eventually Below/equal -> probability doesn’t get in

[–] legendkiller003@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben will get in, and should. Rivers might. Ryan, might not. Ryan had his one year that was better than any year Ben and Phil had, but I don’t think he was a better QB than either of them for their careers.

[–] Vengefuleight@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

HOF is about sustained success over long periods of time imo.

Big Ben checks that box. Matt Ryan had a very solid chunk of time where he was successful, but never got over the SB hump and never regained form after that.

Philip Rivers is probably not getting in due to all the average level teams he played on.

[–] sprout92@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Putting Ben with the likes of a dude who never won a Super Bowl is kind of...shit almost insulting.

Dude went to 3 and won 2 Super Bowls.

I think he'd be the only multi Super Bowl winning qb to NOT make it if he didn't?

[–] ryanstrikesback@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben yes. Ryan and Rivers no.

[–] Brocky70@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Where will the Pro Football Hall of Fame draw the line with QBs?

When the hall stops making money, people will pay to see eli inducted (or the very least travel to watch it)

The real question is how many people will drive 10 hours for it

[–] levitikush@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

A known rapist should not be inducted, regardless of stats or accomplishments. Come the fuck on NFL, please stop rewarding sexual predators.

[–] NatAttack50932@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)
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[–] AlarmingDifficulty25@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben gets in due to the rings. Rivers and Ryan do not. Rivers is basically Tony Romo. Ryan isn’t much higher.

[–] londoncatvet@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

My personal eye test is that only Big Ben belongs among those 3.

[–] Five2one521@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Flacco = No

[–] Jonestyle@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben does super bowls speak loud imo. Matt Ryan needs a sub-par inductee class to get I feel like and rivers doesn’t deserve it. You can’t be in the hall of fame if you aren’t even a conference champion…

[–] p_tk_d@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben shouldn’t make it in

[–] Witty-Jellyfish1218@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Are we sure about Brady?

[–] itscamo-@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben will probably get in at some point (idk how long it'll take tho)

Ryan could get in after a long wait. I don't see rivers ever making it

[–] porkycloset@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

If it was up to me, None of these guys should make it. No SBs for Ryan and Rivers, and the Steelers have played the ugliest football in the league the past 20 years. Out of the three I like Rivers the most but he has the lowest chance of getting in. Realistically, Ryan is 50/50 and Big Ben is definitely getting in with the on-paper results

[–] ml63440@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Ben gets in for sure.

[–] No-Introduction-1492@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

They all should get in. The quarterbacks surrounding them are all HOF. Also with some quarterbacks that don’t belong, but are in, such as Namath or Kelly, only heighten the reason for why those 3 should be in.

[–] OldBrokeGrouch@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I think Rivers is the cutoff. I think he’s as good as you can be without making the HoF. Or at least he should be.

[–] Clipper248@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Being honest none of them should get in...neither 3 was ever the best qb

[–] FundioRider@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Big Ben gets in. Ryan and Rivers don't. Neither won a Superbowl. Plus they combined for ZERO rape accusations.

[–] dharris021@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Big Ben was getting in regardless, so that shouldn’t even be a discussion. Matt Ryan on the other hand is a different story IMO 🤷🏽‍♂️

[–] itwasbetterwhen@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Never considered Ryan for HOF. Maybe I'm missing something. Long career which pads stats and a good 1st half in a super bowl isn't HOF worthy. I'm an Eli fan and his SB performance is all time good, but not enough for HOF. Ben could make it.

[–] jdpatric@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I know I'm a homer, but Ben seems like a sure fire lock to me. Two SB wins, a third appearance. The only QB in the group above with that many is Brady.

I think Rivers gets in before Matt Ryan. Rivers played 2 more seasons, they have similar yardage, Rivers has the edge in touchdowns, and Rivers has a 0.558 record where Ryan has 0.532.

I know Ryan has a Super Bowl appearance where Rivers does not, but that didn't end all too well for Ryan. Reads like a black smudge.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised to see Ryan and Rivers both get in. Just may take a while.

Eli would be surprising...

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[–] nope96@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Ben’s almost certainly gonna make it in

Honestly if the QBs from right now don’t step it up it’ll be harder to argue Rivers and Ryan don’t deserve to be in. When the longest tenured QB in the league has only been with his teams for 8 years and the few older QBs that have stuck around are starting to break down in their mid-30s someone like Rivers being consistently very good or great until he was nearly 40 is going to look more impressive.

Like imagine if in 2033 Joe Burrow was still the Bengals QB and was still Pro Bowler.

[–] bigkeys11@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Burrow right now is better than Rivers was at any point in his career. He’s universally agreed to be the second best in the league, behind only the (maybe) best player in the history of the sport

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[–] hammer_416@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Eli is a lock too. Shouldn’t be. But he is.

[–] PMMeCornelWestQuotes@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Big Ben is the only 1 of those 3 I'd put in

[–] fufuberry21@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Not even a hard question tbh. Ben makes it, the other 2 don't.

[–] togsincognito@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Phil Rivers is the Kerry Collins of 60,000 yard passers

[–] IAmRSChrisG@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

The real question is how long do we have to wait for the BOAT Blake Bortles to get his bust in Canton.

[–] Reduak@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Big Ben yes... Ryan and Rivers... not a chance.

It's the "Hall of FAME," not the "Hall of BETTER THAN AVERAGE."

The real question is, does Eli get in??

[–] Radumami@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Big Ben shouldn't be in the hall of fame simply bc he's a rapist.

[–] HeyylookitsNICK@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Just give them participation plaques.

[–] Huegod@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I think Ryan and Rivers are probably the new line.

I could see that SB loss and MVP pushing Ryan in and keeping Rivers out.

But I think yards and TDs are going to be a watered down state for QBs.

I think the stats outlook will shift to high leverage stats, awards, and titles.

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