DandomRude

joined 2 years ago
[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 3 points 19 minutes ago

Yes, I agree. Explicitly excluding AI training in your terms of use or license probably won't deter most companies, but I think it wouldn't hurt to include this as an addition, since a clear contractual prohibition would likely:

  • reduce ambiguities regarding defenses such as fair use and
  • create an explicit basis for contractual claims that could be additionally enforced if someone ignores the restriction.

For example, when selling a book, you could require explicit consent (checkbox opt-in or similar) to strengthen enforceability. Enforcement would still be difficult, of course, but an explicit clause might at least have a certain deterrent effect and, if necessary, create additional leverage in court, I think.

 

Should such a clause not be added as standard today, similar to the "salvatory clause," provided that the content is not intended for the widest possible distribution?

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago* (last edited 1 hour ago)

Ja, dieser Argumentation, an der durchaus etwas dran ist, sind die Gerichte bislang weitestgehend gefolgt. Dennoch sind m.E. weder LLMs noch Musik- oder Bildgenerierungsmodelle in der Lage, wirklich neue Dinge zu erschaffen.

Was sie tun, ist, Muster in ihrem riesigen Korpus an Trainingsmaterial zu finden, die sie gewissermaßen als eine Art Bauplan oder Vektor abspeichern. Auf Anfrage können sie diese Vektoren wiedergeben und/oder mit anderen solcher Vektoren kombinieren. Daraus ergibt sich dann eine Art Collage, die im Vergleich zum Ausgangsmaterial durchaus etwas neues sein kann und nicht unbedingt direkte Teile aus dem Ausgangsmaterial enthalten muss. Der Grad der "Neuheit" ist jedoch durch die verfügbaren Vektoren begrenzt, die sich aus dem Trainingmaterial ergeben. Der kreative Teil, nämlich die Nutzeranfrage, kann damit nur auf zugegeben sehr viele, jedoch trotzdem nur auf begrenzt viele Arten aus den vorhandenen Vektoren umgesetzt werden.

In einem menschlichen Sinne ist dies insgesamt wohl eher kein kreativer Prozess, sondern viel eher ein statistischer, da das Ergebnis stets auf Grundlage der verfügbaren Muster in Kombination mit einer Wahrscheinlichkeitsrechnung hinsichtlich der Anfrage des Nutzers entsteht. Die KI-Modelle selbst sind nicht in der Lage, etwas von sich aus hinzuzufügen. Wäre es anders, wären die Ergebnisse weitestgehend unbrauchbar, denn sie wären für Menschen unverständlich (sie würden nicht in unsere Welt passen). Diese Modelle haben somit über das Erkennen von Mustern und deren Reproduktion und/oder Kombination mit anderen Mustern hinaus keinerlei Verständnis von den dargestellten Dinge, jedenfalls keines, das menschlichem Verständnis auch nur nahekommen würde.

Das Problem bei all dem ist, dass diese Modelle vielen Menschen die Lebensgrundlage entziehen. Das ist in sich natürlich schon ein wesentliches Problem, jedoch heißt es auch, das künftig umso weniger menschliche Werke entstehen werden. Das wiederum bedeutet, das man sich über kurz oder lang in einen Teufelskreis aus reproduzierten oder kombinierten, jedoch stets bereits vorhandenen Mustern begibt - dann gibt es tatsächlich nichts neues mehr unter der Sonne; nur noch millionenfache "Remixes" von schon Vorhandenem.

Ich denke also, dass es insgesamt durchaus auch eine Diskussion darüber sein sollte, ob und inwieweit Kultur etwas wichtiges und schützenswertes ist. LLMs und dergleichen emulieren Kultur lediglich. Sie selbst sind zu keiner schöpferischen Leistung in der Lage und schränken die Kreativität ihrer Nutzer durch einen begrenzten Satz an möglichen Kombinationen aus gelernten Mustern ein. Es kann daraus Neues entstehen, aber nur in den Grenzen der zugrundeliegenden Logik. Fraglich ist dann eben, ob hierdurch nicht etwas sehr Wesentliches verloren geht bzw. ob sich die Menschen damit abfinden möchten, das Kultur mehr und mehr wie Pop-Musik gehandhabt wird: stets einer vordefinierten Logik folgend, die der Kreativität enge Grenzen setzt.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 2 points 12 hours ago (4 children)

Nevertheless, Spotify makes more profit than any music label, even more than all the remaining music labels combined. This is how it works today: music, literature, journalism, and art no longer exist according to this logic - only content. And as disrespectful as the term sounds, that's how it's paid for - with scrabs because that's the business model.

Your pirate approach is no longer up to date, because it is no longer directed against large corporations, but robs artists of the little they have left. This will only accelerate the trend: no one will try to make a living from art anymore. If you think that people will do it anyway because they want to express themselves, I think you are absolutely wrong.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 29 points 13 hours ago (6 children)

Spotify absolutely deserves to be singled out for its exploitative practices, especially since this company is largely responsible for musicians not being paid fairly for their hard work. It's just a shame that there's hardly anything to steal here other than people's hard work, to which Spotify has contributed nothing - but that applies to all companies that are successful on the internet today. Without exception, all of these companies are built on the same platform logic: the content that these companies exploit is paid for with starvation wages, if at all (not at all in the case of LLMs).

Therefore, I cannot see anything positive in this because it does not change the underlying problem in the slightest.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 4 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago)

I completely agree with you regarding Nestlé. The fact that it is a European company does not make its practices any better. I see the behavior of the US as an opportunity to rethink my consumption habits anyway—if I am already researching which products to buy, I might as well weed out those suppliers who stand for the same unscrupulous logic: Nestlé is definitely one of them.

So thank you for the additional information.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 1 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

Cool things sell well. That's why there are many brands in Europe that sound American but aren't actually American. Philadelphia, a brand that has been around in Europe for a long time, could just as easily be from a European manufacturer, but that's not the case.

Another example: In Germany, there are countless pizza delivery services called New York Pizza or something similar. These are, of course, small local companies from Germany that have simply named themselves that way.

Due to the long, close relationship between Europe and the US, this has developed to such an extent that it is now almost impossible to tell from the brand name whether a company is European or not. Now, for obvious reasons, it is unfortunately necessary to boycott US products - which is easier said than done, because US companies own numerous former EU brands that sound European and, on the other hand, many EU companies have given their products American-sounding names.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 3 points 22 hours ago

They are pure evil, but a company from Switzerland.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Sorry, my mistake, that's right. Leibnitz is owned by Bahlsen, a German family business.

I've corrected the description in the post. Thanks for pointing that out.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Evian is owned by Danone (Dannon in some countries), which is a multinational corporation, but one that was founded in Spain and is now headquartered in Paris.

[–] DandomRude@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (4 children)

It should be, but in many countries around the world, the US was long considered cool, which is why brands were named accordingly - that has changed significantly...

Edit: You know, the orange child molester who blackmails all his allies, shamelessly enriches himself, and gets away with it. The rest of the world just doesn't think that's so cool...

 

Here are just a few examples from Europe:

  • Milka | Mondelez
  • Toblerone | Mondelez
  • Philadelphia | Mondelez
  • LU cookies | Mondelez
  • Pampers | Procter & Gamble
  • Ariel, Tide | Procter & Gamble
  • Oral-B | Procter & Gamble
  • Gillette | Procter & Gamble
  • Head & Shoulders | Procter & Gamble
  • Colgate| Colgate‑Palmolive Company
  • Lay’s | PepsiCo
 

Vielleicht helfen solche Petitionen unseren Politikern ja dabei, ihre verantwortungslose Social-Media-Strategie zu überdenken, wenn das Volk sie explizit darauf hinweist, wie absurd es ist, dass sie Accounts auf einer rechtsextremen Propaganda-Plattform betreiben. 12.000 Bürger sind es immerhin schon.

Vielleicht hilft es ja auch, der Politik in Erinnerung zu rufen, dass sie dieses Elend selbst verursacht haben und es weiter aktiv unterstützen, indem sie Monopole fördern anstatt sie zu bekämpfen.

Vielleicht hilft es ihnen ja dabei, das Fediverse zu entdecken.

Nichts davon ist wahrscheinlich, aber einen Versuch scheint es wert.

 

What is sold as culture today is just that: a product; a derivative of humanity, sold by the world's most successful companies as a hollow substitute, but one that sells like hotcakes.

 

LLMs and image generation models make it even more difficult for artists and thinkers, who are already in a precarious situation, to make a living from their work. This is not a recent development, as evidenced by the fact that they have been referred to indiscriminately as merely content producers for decades, which gives the loss of value of their important work a telling name even in today's logic.

This professional group has not received adequate financial recognition for its work, - tbh they never did - but their situation has become way worse since the advent of the World Wide Web.

Still: Today's technology in the form of so-called AI intensives this problem to an unprecedented degree.

So: Have we reached the end of culture and are we now entering an age of absolute dullness in which there can no longer be a critical spirit, but only amateurish work and industrially mass-produced corporate views? All that however far removed from the craftsmanship that has so significantly shaped the culture of all civilizations throughout the world's history for so long?

 

Investors like this approach because it sells so well even if nothing much is behind it. The logic: don't pay attention to the business model, don't emphasize this, but put everything on companies that appear promising with their product some time far in the future - throw money at it until it is hyped - then sell before reality kicks in.

This is not to say that there are no use cases for LLMs—there certainly are, and in very different contexts. I am simply pointing out that the market value of the companies involved is hopelessly overvalued—far removed from reality.

The only thing that makes this completely reckless approach absolutely foolproof for large investors is the fact that all large investors are involved. This ensures that the share prices will rise until the large investors agree to sell, at which point it won't be long before everything collapses—whether it's a useful technology or a viable product doesn't really matter at this point.

This is how today's stock market works due to the massive centralization of capital: All you need to know is which stocks major investors and politicians, who are paid to pass the relevant legislation, are investing in.

You can make it all seem much more complicated than it really is, but that's the bottom line.

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