HelloLemmySup

I think its hard for some americans to understand that welfare in Europe is not an utopia. I personally believe the estate needs to provide help and support to citizens including healthcare and basic education at a minimum. Ideally some basic help for people that are unable to work and whatever is needed for people to not be on the street.

My biggest issue is as it is right now I can see how much money I have been putting over the years and how much extra money I still need to put on top privately to have a quality of life for things such as pension, salary insurance, etc. So while almost half my salary goes out as taxes I still need to contribute on my own to private companies. On top of that I can see people that can take advantage of the system and between the high taxes and all the help you can get (house help, unemployment, lids, etc.) theres people not working that get almost as much as an engineer working full time. I think something is off.

But this has nothing to do with the post of why american companies choose to pay more than european ones.

I didnt expect so many replies and its hard to keep with comments so sometimes I may have skimmed some replies too fast (like your comment on taxes for companies ;)). Im also on phone.

People have also started talking about welfare and taxation which is irrelevant to the question which was why US companies pay more (pre-tax). I think this dereiled and I wanted to edit the post to l clarify but my mobile client doesnt have edit post functionality yet. I have to admit I got a bit annoyed because that had nothing to do with my question and turned into a us vs europe welfare/benefits which has nothing to do with pre-tax salaries. When broght that even in Europe with the same welfare and benefits US companies pay mroe people still kept talking about welfare. Its a bit annoying to be fair

Loyalty is all great until a depression comes or a bad decission causes layoffs. Then suddenly all the loyalty and being a family means nothing. I think back in the days when 5% raises were the norm and you could buy a house in 5 years on one income being loyal made sense. Now since companies do not keep up with inflation and the standards of living are so high I believe its in your best interest to do whatever its needed to get a better job. If staying in the same company gives you that its great but most often than not changing jobs often and testing the market will do you better imho.

Everyone or almost everyone is in an union here. My point was these statistics that come from the union are very reliable so when I say american companies pay 30-80% more consistently here it is quite accurate. Its not some online poll or something I have heard.

My point still stands that while laws and welfare are different in the US when an american company comes to Europe it must follow its local laws. At that point its the same as a local one but chooses to pay way more.

There is a clear difference in pay between american and non american companies here and that I think can only be attributed to american companies choosing to pay more to attract talent and european ones being more relaxed and pay average attracting more average talent. I think this is a cultural thing where the US is a more competitive country and benefits us (developers).

I think sometimes its also the ilusion of safety. An european company can fire you basically at will in Denmark - its just not often people get fired unless the company is struggling a lot. But it can happen. I saw the case personally with someone getting fired because the manager didnt like him even though he worked well in a local company and no one beats and eye.

The american companies here still have at least some local managers. So perhaps theres some meetings a bit late sometimes but other than that its the same as a local company. Except you get paid way more for the same job.

And since they follow the same laws and regulations as any orher local company I think its better off to work for these. In the event you get fired you got some extra money by working in one and can get another job in another one after.

I see your point better now - thanks for claryfing. Still shouldnt european companies that have massive profits choose to pay also way more? I cant see much difference between salaries in local companies (even with big well profitable ones). I would expect some to pay 2x for example then if they can afford it (they can in some cases I know).

But from what you suggest it may be possinle for some american companies in europe to benefit from some taxation stuff and by doing so they can pay more. What I hear is they can pay more and choose to do so to get talent in contrast with local companies that could do the same bur rather keep it to them instead. So again without trying to sound arrogant I think US rewards talent and europe mediocrity.

I know the numbers by heart. And getting 100k usd before taxes is hard in Europe. No one usually talks after taxes that doesnt make sense as taxation changes among countries and your situation (some people get more tax exemptions than others for example if you have loans)

Each country has its own things that are better and worse. At the end of the day US companies pay more before taxes than european ones do for the same job. And when american companies come to Europe they also pay more.

I think the discussion of welfare, taxes, etc. is another talk which is independent of this post which id about before taxes salaries for the same type of jobs.

That could explain some but still “old” hardware companies not even software ones can pay well above market here. I would imagine these to be more similar to european stable companies.

I think ultimately the US choses to pay more for certain jobs at the expense of some others getting less. In Norway for example I read somewhere software developers only make 20% more than the average worker. I think that would be unimaginable in the US. Theres simply not the same reward for hard work in Europe as theres in USA and I think its dangerous because it tells people to do the bare minimum and make Europe less competitive. Why study for 5 years and work hard (mentally) all your life when you can just work in a factory or flip burgers etc for next to the same?

Reading some comments I think laws are weaker in the US and companies need to pay more as hiring a worker there is closer to hiring a contractor here in terms on how easy is to fire. But still these companies choose to pay more when they come to Europe to attract talent.

I dont remember the exact numbers but it was around 1/5-1/6 of what I make a year now. I mean if you have the house fully paid and dont have any expense other than food maybe its technically possible but its so low you need the private one. And if you rent all your life like some people do then Im not sure what would be your options.

In the danish reddit people also say take an american job in denmark never look back. The best of both worlds american salary with danish welfare and protection laws. I was just trying to understand why its only them that pay well and the rest dont do more than average.

Most people take these statistics where I work and are very reliable. Theyre so reliable than when you go take a salary negotiation they pull them out and say you should get around that and its not much more you can get usually. Unless the company is american. Then again 30-80% more than average is expected according to these surveys which have been correct so far everytime Ive used them.

Its so ridiculous than a newly graduated engineer that is lucky to work for an american company can get more salary than a person with 20 years experience in an average company. And thats why I created the post why do americans pay more even outside of America.