MeanwhileOnGrad
"Oh, this is calamity! Calamity! Oh no, he's on the floor!"
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Meanwhile On Grad
Documenting hate speech, conspiracy theories, apologia/revisionism, and general tankie behaviour across the fediverse. Memes are welcome!
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We did get to the debate part, you can click the link and see how it went down. Goat was asked to provide a defense for points they made stating that Palestine ought to resist only by adopting Western liberal ideals, and that resistance by military means is illegitimate. They refused to actually elaborate on that point.
When prompted on forming revolutionary organizations in the United States, goat claimed that such an effort is useless because Americans will never amount to anything because they are too distracted.
That wasn't a debate at all lol
I never argued for any of my points because I didn't see why I should bother to argue them, it wouldn't convince any tankie and hearing the same slogans from the same redsails sources and talking points won't do much to convince me (perhaps if it was from something more reputable or argued in favour of individual freedoms, such as the workers) -- I don't really bother with any argument unless there's a baseline we can fall back on, which I offered.
Rape is also not resistance, it's predation, it's poison. Do you think the civil rights movement succeeded with raping their oppressors? No. They primarily used non-violence -- And if you're going to argue that violence was what succeeded, know that racists make the same arguments.
And I stand by what I said on the US populace, they are too cowardly, and so are Tankies, as evidently displayed.
When universal human rights are denounced as "Western liberal ideals", we know that you have no interest in an actual debate.
Those were Goat's words. Goat said the following:
I'd say rather than Western ideals, they should support the human rights some Western ideals are based on. My biggest contentions with Islamist regimes are women's and queer rights. Sure acceptance of queer people is a long road for such societies, but you can make sure that the government doesn't persecute them and that the government even enforces non-discrimination regulations.
I considered saying human rights, but Israel doesn't give a shit about those and seemingly no other power does either.
You don't see why saying this about Gaza is patently absurd? They don't have a functioning government. The whole place is nothing but rubble and families trying to find the bodies of their loved ones buried underneath that rubble. They've been subjected to 2 years of constant aerial bombardment, as if the previous decades of occupation, no access to clean water or any economic contact with the rest of the world wasn't bad enough. It just strikes me as something one can only say if they don't know anything about the situation at hand, and they only know that Gaza is a city and Palestine is a country.
Like seriously, they live in a concentration camp. Would you say anything like this about the inmates of Auschwitz? Oh no, some of them are misogynists! Oh no, some of them have backwards social views on queer people! Can you do something about the gas chambers first before you deal with those topics, though?
Gaza doesn't have a functioning government, no. That's one of the reasons why I hate Hamas, since they had time and resources to establish a functioning government and present themselves as such, but they actively refused to do so, instead seeking out militarism and oppression.
And yes, you can argue Israel was influencing Hamas, which in my opinion is even more reason why you shouldn't be in support of them.
I'm also curious. Why do you think some parts of Gaza, before the recent conflict, had no supply of clean water? As you know, Israel, when it occupied Gaza, built extensive infrastructure since they planned on colonisation until the international community booted them out. So what happened to the water pipes? Israel couldn't remove them per stipulation, so where did they go?
You can reply with your main alt, I won't ban it.
(This was removed by automod, I've gone ahead and restored the comment)