This is all just absolutely wild to me because I went to an all-women’s college and we had no issues accepting trans women (there was a trans woman there when I was a student and it was honestly no big thing for anyone), and that was quite a while ago (I’m so old lol). But NOW it’s a damn issue? I feel like we’ve regressed so much and it’s painful.
this post was submitted on 29 Aug 2023
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Conservatives won on abortion and have found the next entry in the "then they came for" list.
The bigots got ballsy once they got unified, if we want things back the way they were we need to beat bigots back into the shadows of society and encourage behaviours that makes them run. No tolerance for intolerance.
It feels that way because we have, thanks to the "Christian" right directing the full force of their propaganda machine at demonizing trans people.
It became the de jure culture war issue. People who didn't care before, do now -- because now it's a team sport.
It’s an issue ONLY because it’s a useful angle for Tempe culture wars. Look how they have turned some gays against each other with this anti trans bullshit. It’s only an issue now because gays are too popular and so trans is a nice little niche group that can be persecuted without as much PR damage
Were they living in your house?
Not in my dorm, no. But she was living on campus in a dorm and no one seemed to give the smallest of fucks at the time. I wouldn’t have cared in the slightest had she been living in my dorm.
Oh and.
Anassa kata kalo kale,
Ia, ia, ia, Nike!
Bryn Mawr, Bryn Mawr, Bryn Mawr
TRANS WOMEN ARE WOMEN.
Women with traumatic pasts can be afraid if they want. Just look at what happens in prisons when a transsexual mtf goes into female population and ends up having a bunch of sex or even raping other inmates. It's not like it's completely out of the realm of possibility.
Can you cite an example of this ever happening?
Your second example is false. Your first points to a systemic problem with Riker's as evidenced here: https://www.bronxda.nyc.gov/downloads/pdf/pr/2021/39-2021%20rikers-island-violence-indictments.pdf
"Since Grand Juries re-convened in late February/March of 2021, the Rikers Island Prosecution Bureau has indicted 37 cases involving assaults on staff as well as assaults by detainees on detainees. The majority of the cases were brought to the bureau by Department of Correction’s Correction Intelligence Bureau as investigations. There are currently approximately 268 open investigations."
Looks like you found one example in amongst a whole bunch of other assaults which were not committed by trans people.
3 links. And if there's even one it can certainly make rape victims uncomfortable about sharing a living space with men, or "penis havers". Maybe they're in a sorority to stay away from dicks.
You asked for an example of it ever happening and I provided examples of it ever happening but you ignore them and claim one is false. Great goalpost moving there.
I missed the first one, that's problematic as an example, did you read what you linked to? The Guardian one is false.
The Riker's one does seem to support your assertion but it's mixed in with a whole bunch of other assaults because it's Riker's.
I literally do not care enough to read the articles, but you're saying that one of them proved my point. You asked for one. Apparently I gave you one and again you're shifting the goal posts.
The best you could come up with was one perpetrated at one of the most lawless and violent prisons in the country, one that is not fit for purpose but hey, you think you won an argument so you enjoy that.
Worth noting that this was not a great leap - the judge didn't rule anything particularly interesting about trans rights, he simply said that freedom of association means you can't go to court to force a private organization to exclude someone.
Exactly. I disagree strongly with the sorority's decision, but can/should we compel individuals to hang out with people they don't want to hang out with?
If the group receives public money, it's a whole different situation
I'm assuming that the majority of members are fine with this, otherwise they'd simply change their bylaws to exclude trans women (and probably get away with doing so for the same legal reason). These 6 members were probably the losers of some internal battle who went to court to try to get their way anyway and failed.
Ah. This makes a whole lot more sense.
I saw this story this morning and could not for the life of me figure out what had happened.
None of it made sense until I saw your comment.
otherwise they'd simply change their bylaws to exclude trans women (and probably get away with doing so for the same legal reason).
I don't think that'd work. Which is why most of the laws we're seeing from shithole states target medical care or other things instead of outright banning them.
Bostock v. Clayton County decided sexual orientation and gender identity fall within the Title VII of the Civil Rights act as under the protected class of "sex". This should decisively prevent anyone from outright discriminating against LGBT+ people, but we know how inventive conservatives get with oppressing others.
This explanation certainly makes me feel the least concerned for the new sister, so I hope so!
The sorority admitted the trans woman. This suit was filed by members of the sorority in an attempt to force the sorority to exclude her as a member. Are you sure you strongly disagree with the sorority's decision to admit a trans woman?
Ah I didn't RTFA
I disagree strongly with the sorority’s decision
to not exclude the trans woman?
can/should we compel individuals to hang out with people they don’t want to hang out with?
of course not, but if the people who don't want to "hang out" with others only don't want to because of wilfully ignorant hate (in other words - for no good reason, and of course this isn't about not wanting to hang out this is about excluding and attempting to erase an entire group of people), it shouldn't be the person who they hate for no good reason who is excluded, but them.
Agree on principle, but you simply can't make private organizations associate with someone they don't want to.
Sure, I bet some of the members were fine with her joining, but they joined an organization with a decision making hierarchy, and have to abide by that leadership's vote/decision. If they don't like the decision they should leave, and join a more open group. (or work to remove the leadership and bring about the changes they want).
In this case it sounds like the rules didn't bar her from joining so I don't get the case at all.
Trans women are women, don't come at me like I'm a bigot.
You're missing a key fact here: the sorority admitted her. This suit was by individual members trying to force the sorority to reverse their decision. This decision didn't establish new rights for trans people or affirm their existing rights, it affirmed the right of an organization to establish membership criteria that can't be overridden even by members of that organization.
How this would go wrt gender/sex being federally protected classes is an interesting question, but hasn't been examined by this case. All this did was establish that these 6 hateful shitheads can't force the rest of the group to be hateful shitheads. Or, more accurately, it failed to establish that they can.
You didn't read my comment till the end
In all of these situations, replace trans woman with, say, black woman. Now how does it sound?
Pretty shitty! What, are you trying to use a gotcha?
You can't make private groups accept someone. It sucks, and results in some very distasteful scenarios.
Employment or public groups? Very different.
I think black women should be allowed in sororities even if individual members object. This is in keeping with the law that allows private organizations to associate freely under most circumstances but prevents discrimination based on federally protected classes.
Idk, sounds pretty okay to me
That was my point exactly. Can’t discriminate against protected classes.
I mean, I'm pretty sure the Ku Klux Klan doesn't allow black women. They have the right to do that.
Well, the ones who don't want to hang out with others are free to leave.
Desegregation seems to have worked out better than segregation did for the affected minorities. Why wouldn't it be the same here?
Imagine having the time and resources to be such a shit in this way. The main thing is don't be a transphobe, but then a substantial secondary thing is get a life.
Good good. Hope they lose a very expensive defamation case next.
Fucking nonsense. The sorority defined what woman meant when they voted to admit the member. There was no possible context this should've been filed. Those lawyers need to be sanctioned for even filling something like this.
Edit: judge didn't even dismiss it with prejudice https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.wyd.63248/gov.uscourts.wyd.63248.31.0.pdf
This is the best summary I could come up with:
(AP) — A judge has dismissed a lawsuit contesting a transgender woman’s admission into a sorority at the University of Wyoming, ruling that he could not override how the private, voluntary organization defined a woman and order that she not belong.
Wyoming U.S. District Court Judge Alan Johnson, in his ruling, found that sorority bylaws don’t define who’s a woman.
The case at Wyoming’s only four-year public university drew widespread attention as transgender people fight for more acceptance in schools, athletics, workplaces and elsewhere, while others push back.
“With its inquiry beginning and ending there, the court will not define a ‘woman’ today,” Johnson wrote.
But while the lawsuit portrayed Langford as a “sexual predator,” claims about her behavior turned out to be a “nothing more than a drunken rumor,” Berkness said.
An attorney for the sorority sisters, Cassie Craven, said by email they disagreed with the ruling and the fundamental issue — the definition of a woman — remains undecided.
The original article contains 362 words, the summary contains 161 words. Saved 56%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Fucking bigots.