this post was submitted on 11 Sep 2023
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[–] BombOmOm@lemmy.world 187 points 2 years ago (4 children)

The difficult part of software development has always been the continuing support. Did the chatbot setup a versioning system, a build system, a backup system, a ticketing system, unit tests, and help docs for users. Did it get a conflicting request from two different customers and intelligently resolve them? Was it given a vague problem description that it then had to get on a call with the customer to figure out and hunt down what the customer actually wanted before devising/implementing a solution?

This is the expensive part of software development. Hiring an outsourced, low-tier programmer for almost nothing has always been possible, the low-tier programmer being slightly cheaper doesn't change the game in any meaningful way.

[–] Knusper@feddit.de 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Yeah, I'm already quite content, if I know upfront that our customer's goal does not violate the laws of physics.

Obviously, there's also devs who code more run-of-the-mill stuff, like yet another business webpage, but those are still coded anew (and not just copy-pasted), because customers have different and complex requirements. So, even those are still quite a bit more complex than designing just any Gomoku game.

[–] NoRodent@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago

I’m already quite content, if I know upfront that our customer’s goal does not violate the laws of physics.

Haha, this is so true and I don't even work in IT. For me there's bonus points if the customer's initial idea is solvable within Euclidean geometry.

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[–] theluddite@lemmy.ml 126 points 2 years ago (6 children)

"I gave an LLM a wildly oversimplified version of a complex human task and it did pretty well"

For how long will we be forced to endure different versions of the same article?

The study said 86.66% of the generated software systems were "executed flawlessly."

Like I said yesterday, in a post celebrating how ChatGPT can do medical questions with less than 80% accuracy, that is trash. A company with absolute shit code still has virtually all of it "execute flawlessly." Whether or not code executes it not the bar by which we judge it.

Even if it were to hit 100%, which it does not, there's so much more to making things than this obviously oversimplified simulation of a tech company. Real engineering involves getting people in a room, managing stakeholders, navigating conflicting desires from different stakeholders, getting to know the human beings who need a problem solved, and so on.

LLMs are not capable of this kind of meaningful collaboration, despite all this hype.

[–] thantik@lemmy.world 27 points 2 years ago

AI regularly hallucinates API endpoints that don't exist, functions that aren't part of that language, libraries that don't exist. There's no fucking way it did any of this bullshit. Like, yeah - it can probably do a mean autocomplete, but this is being pushed so hard because they want to drive wages down even harder. They want know-nothing middle-managers to point to this article and say "I can replace you with AI, get to work!"...that's the only purpose of this crap.

[–] PlexSheep@feddit.de 17 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

Thank you for writing this so I only have to ~~upvore~~ upvote you.

Edit: What the difference between one key can be

[–] Absolutemehperson@lemmy.world 19 points 2 years ago

I only have to upvore you

holy music stops

[–] nul@programming.dev 13 points 2 years ago (4 children)

I don't know what an upvore is and I don't want to know.

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[–] superfes@lemmy.world 9 points 2 years ago (2 children)

But they could replace CEOs from what I can tell.

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[–] flamekhan@lemmy.world 75 points 2 years ago

"We asked a Chat Bot to solve a problem that already has a solution and it did ok."

[–] breadsmasher@lemmy.world 67 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It cost less than a dollar to run all those chatbots?

Doubt

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[–] igorlogius@lemmy.world 62 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (4 children)

Do managment next and lets see who's gonna be replaced first

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[–] doublejay1999@lemmy.world 61 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Plot twist - the AI just cut and paste from stack overflow like real devs.

[–] scarabic@lemmy.world 53 points 2 years ago

A test that doesn’t include a real commercial trial or A/B test with real human customers means nothing. Put their game in the App Store and tell us how it performs. We don’t care that it shat out code that compiled successfully. Did it produce something real and usable or just gibberish that passed 86% of its own internal unit tests, which were also gibberish?

[–] Pistcow@lemm.ee 39 points 2 years ago (3 children)
[–] ArbiterXero@lemmy.world 64 points 2 years ago (5 children)

As someone that uses ChatGPT daily for boilerplate code because it’s super helpful…

I call complete bullshite

The program here will be “hello world” or something like that.

[–] LazaroFilm@lemmy.world 25 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Absolutely I can create a code for your app.

void myApp(void) {
  // add the code for your app here
  return true;
}

You may need to change the code above to fit your needs. Make sure you replace the comment with the proper code for your app to work.

[–] whileloop@lemmy.world 18 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Couldn't even write a void method right, return true!

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[–] ipha@lemm.ee 21 points 2 years ago (1 children)

"hello world" as a service?

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[–] Ertebolle@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago

OTOH, if you take that hello world program and ask it to compose a themed cocktail menu around it, it'll cheerfully do that for you.

[–] Semi-Hemi-Demigod@kbin.social 6 points 2 years ago (9 children)

It's great for things like "How do I write this kind of loop in this language" but when I asked it for something more complex like a class or a big-ish function it hallucinates. But it makes for a very fast way to get up to speed in a new language

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[–] KoboldCoterie@pawb.social 15 points 2 years ago (3 children)

The study said 86.66% of the generated software systems were "executed flawlessly."

But...

Nevertheless, the study isn't perfect: Researchers identified limitations, such as errors and biases in the language models, that could cause issues in the creation of software. Still, the researchers said the findings "may potentially help junior programmers or engineers in the real world" down the line.

[–] scarabic@lemmy.world 24 points 2 years ago

So… they failed 13.34% of their own unit tests?

[–] radix@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago

🎵🎵 99 little bugs in the code, 99 bugs in the code, Fix one bug, compile it again, 101 little bugs in the code. 101 little bugs in the code, 101 bugs in the code, Fix one bug, compile it again, 103 little bugs in the code. 🎵🎵

[–] scarabic@lemmy.world 11 points 2 years ago

And how long did it take to compose the “assignments?” Humans can work with less precise instructions than machines, usually, and improvise or solve problems along the way or at least sense when a problem should be flagged for escalation and review.

[–] kitonthenet@kbin.social 17 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

At the designing stage, the CEO asked the CTO to "propose a concrete programming language" that would "satisfy the new user's demand," to which the CTO responded with Python. In turn, the CEO said, "Great!" and explained that the programming language's "simplicity and readability make it a popular choice for beginners and experienced developers alike."

I find it extremely funny that project managers are the ones chatbots have learned to immitate perfectly, they already were doing the robot’s work: saying impressive sounding things that are actually borderline gibberish

[–] thanks_shakey_snake@lemmy.ca 7 points 2 years ago

What does it even mean for a programming language to "satisfy the new user's demand?" Like when has the user ever cared whether your app is built in Python or Ruby or Common Lisp?

It's like "what notebook do I need to buy to pass my exams," or "what kind of car do I need to make sure I get to work on time?"

Yet I'm 100% certain that real human executives have had equivalent conversations.

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[–] Knusper@feddit.de 16 points 2 years ago

the CTO responded with Python. In turn, the CEO said, "Great!" and explained that the programming language's "simplicity and readability make it a popular choice for beginners and experienced developers alike."

Yep, that does sound like my CEO.

[–] blazera@kbin.social 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Researchers, for example, tasked ChatDev to "design a basic Gomoku game," an abstract strategy board game also known as "Five in a Row."

What tech company is making Connect Four as their business model?

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[–] gencha@feddit.de 9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What a load of bullshit. If you have a group of researchers provide "minimal human input" to a bunch of LLMs to produce a laughable program like tic-tac-toe, then please just STFU or at least don't tell us it cost $1. This doesn't even have the efficiency of a Google search. This AI hype needs to die quick

[–] autotldr@lemmings.world 7 points 2 years ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:


AI chatbots like OpenAI's ChatGPT can operate a software company in a quick, cost-effective manner with minimal human intervention, a new study has found.

Based on the waterfall model — a sequential approach to creating software — the company was broken down into four different stages, in chronological order: designing, coding, testing, and documenting.

After assigning ChatDev 70 different tasks, the study found that the AI-powered company was able to complete the full software development process "in under seven minutes at a cost of less than one dollar," on average — all while identifying and troubleshooting "potential vulnerabilities" through its "memory" and "self-reflection" capabilities.

"Our experimental results demonstrate the efficiency and cost-effectiveness of the automated software development process driven by CHATDEV," the researchers wrote in the paper.

The study's findings highlight one of the many ways powerful generative AI technologies like ChatGPT can perform specific job functions.

Nevertheless, the study isn't perfect: Researchers identified limitations, such as errors and biases in the language models, that could cause issues in the creation of software.


The original article contains 639 words, the summary contains 172 words. Saved 73%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

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