this post was submitted on 22 Sep 2025
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Privacy

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Hello guys, today I wanted to talk about a project I deeply care about and I'm actively contributing to, as I believe its good for everyone, including privacy concerned users

Ladybird Browser

This browser comes from the project "SerenityOS", and has since evolved and separated from it. The founders are Andreas Kling, and Chris Wanstrath. The main goal of this project is to create a browser from scratch, avoiding chromium, gecko, etc. The main keypoints that should be of interest for Privacy Oriented Users are the following:

  • Ladybird lead (Andreas Kling) states "We're not monetizing users, in any way. This is uncharted territory for browsers. So we're not going to do any default search deals. We're not going to do cryptocurrencies or try to monetize user data, just sponsorships and donations"

  • While** Ladybird will implement current web standards including cookie handling and tracking mechanisms for compatibility**, the browser's philosophy puts the user in control of these decisions, not the company. The browser won't have built-in incentives to encourage data collection since it doesn't profit from it.

  • It aims to be "free from advertising's influence" Ladybird, representing a shift away from the current web ecosystem where users like us are the product. This allows the project to implement privacy features without worrying about harming advertising partners or revenue streams.

As of now, the project has hired several developers with money coming from donations, from partners such as FUTO, Shopify, Cloudflare, among many, and is also seeing lots of volunteer activity on github. So well, if you like the web having more diversity and us having another alternative to google, check them out https://ladybird.org/

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[–] who@feddit.org 98 points 1 week ago (8 children)

I'm excited to see Ladybird developing, but the project accepting money from Cloudflare makes me wary. Between Cloudflare's man-in-the-middle position in a great deal of web traffic, and their similarly invasive position as a major DNS-over-HTTPS provider, they are not remotely privacy-friendly.

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 97 points 1 week ago (3 children)

Ladybird is a nom profit, and its system consist in limiting sponsor max donation to 100k per year, so no company can sponsor more than that and make ladybird dependent on them. On top of that, they try to balance budget to keep money for 18months of salaries at all times, so they dont feel the need to rush decisions and can have stable development

[–] who@feddit.org 35 points 1 week ago

Good to know. I hope that's sufficient to keep them insulated from this major privacy violator's influence.

[–] paraphrand@lemmy.world 28 points 1 week ago

Nom nom nom.

[–] talentedkiwi@sh.itjust.works 27 points 1 week ago (1 children)
[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 15 points 1 week ago

I'm not fixing that typo after such a good response

[–] khannie@lemmy.world 36 points 1 week ago

Their website says:

All sponsorships are in the form of unrestricted donations. Board seats and other forms of influence are not for sale.

So Cloudflare and other sponsors don't get a say which is comforting.

[–] jaennaet@sopuli.xyz 30 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Well, it's definitely not optimal, but I doubt they have any say in the project's direction, so I'm OK with this as long as there's no proof of shady shit going on.

I'd rather they take the money (as long as Cloudflare isn't using the threat of pulling funding as leverage to affect development) than refuse it on the grounds of Cloudflare being a shit company; having alternative browser & JS engines is more important than ideological purity, imo.

Like I said, not optimal, but not a lot is nowadays…

[–] Cethin@lemmy.zip 17 points 1 week ago

Yeah, this fits with the "don't correct your enemy when they're making a mistake" category. Take their money and use it for good. As long as they don't have a say in how it's spent, it's better to take it from them than it go to effect something in a bad way.

[–] null_dot@lemmy.dbzer0.com 22 points 1 week ago

The project needs money from somewhere.

[–] Kushan@lemmy.world 10 points 1 week ago (3 children)

I'm not sure I follow, are you saying cloudflare isn't privacy friendly due to their unique position and general success as a CDN, or are you alluding to them doing something actively privacy invading?

I'm just trying to understand the argument here, I don't quite follow what it is that CF has done wrong.

[–] erev@lemmy.world 13 points 1 week ago (1 children)

They have nearly monopolized a lot of web traffic with their CDN, proxies, and other services. Yes they can provide a good product, but this much influence over the internet is not a good thing. it's not healthy for maintaining an open web, but that's long since been killed.

[–] Kushan@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Okay but just so we're clear, you're not accusing them of any direct wrongdoing, it's more of a "they have too much power" kind of deal?

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[–] scytale@piefed.zip 48 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I hope they come out with extension support immediately and uBO follows up with compatibility after.

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I'm sure they'll get extension support at some point. They also said they intend to add a built in adblocker

[–] pupbiru@aussie.zone 29 points 1 week ago (1 children)

i wish they wouldn’t add a built in adblocker… i just want it to be the most minimal browser engine, and i want to be able to choose the adblocker

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 1 week ago

I believe they are building it to have it as long as they don't have extension support and market

I doubt they'll force it on release

[–] 18107@aussie.zone 16 points 1 week ago

I don't mind an adblocker extension installed by default (for non tech-minded users), but a built in adblocker is just irritating. I want to have control over which extensions I use. Building an adblocker into the browser just takes more development time, and reduces freedom for everyone.

[–] null_dot@lemmy.dbzer0.com 33 points 1 week ago

When I first became aware of this project I was pretty dismissive.

I'm very happy to admit in this case that the project has come further than I thought it would.

Their FAQ says they have 8, paid, full time devs and resources for something like 18 months. IDK how much it really takes to get a browser off the ground but they've got something, at least.

I'm looking forward to their Alpha release in 2026, and really hope they can achieve that.

[–] Deceptichum@quokk.au 20 points 1 week ago (2 children)

What do companies like Shopify hope to gain from this?

[–] pipes@sh.itjust.works 33 points 1 week ago

My guess would be to have their business less dependant on Google's whims and more reliant on actual web standards

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 24 points 1 week ago

They give a good Image to this kind of developer and enthusiasts group

Also, a possible chance of not having to depend on google, for 100k bucks, thats a really cheap ticket for them

[–] Fitik@fedia.io 19 points 1 week ago (1 children)

There's also !Servo@programming.dev browser engine that is being actively developed.

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 1 week ago

I knew of their existence, but I should keep an eye on servo

[–] Ging@anarchist.nexus 12 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (6 children)

Lady/Thunder/Betterbird seem excellent.
What other fowl software is worth a try?

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[–] Asidonhopo@lemmy.world 10 points 1 week ago
[–] SlartyBartFast@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Who are browsers usually built for? Dogs?

[–] veniasilente@lemmy.dbzer0.com 32 points 1 week ago

Statistically speaking, for advertisers. That's, like, four levels removed from "dogs" and three from "bitches".

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 15 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Mainly humans, but ladybird is built for dogs who like ladybugs and birds and, tech :)

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[–] Cybersec@piefed.social 9 points 1 week ago (3 children)

How soon might it be ready to use?

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 1 week ago

Alpha is expected sometime 2026 (but far from perfect) A more polished now beta, in 2027 And if all goes well, the first 1.0 release in 2028

Still, probably for most people it won't be worth using until the beta releases, or even until 1.0

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[–] N4kt0@lemmy.zip 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Are they going to cram a bunch of AI bullshit into it like Mozilla is doing with Firefox?

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 15 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Companies and organizations earn money by selling user data from these intrusive AIs, and ladybird is the complete opposite, so I doubt it, probably the closest thing to that will be allowing users to have their preferred AI linked on the sidebar, which is normal and non-intrusive by itself

Edit: Some companies earn even more money just by keeping investors happy with this AI bubble

[–] Lumisal@lemmy.world 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I've donated to them before, but I remember some anti-LGBTQ+ issues from one of the lead developers I think a few years ago. Has that been addressed?

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I believe the project has been parked on neutrality and common respect for a while, the biggest "controversy" I know of is that the lead developer and founder said something about hiring back when he worked at apple, based on inclusivity vs talent, being a bad way of doing things, and people went crazy over that

[–] 4am@lemmy.zip 29 points 1 week ago (1 children)

The controversy was about a pull request being submitted that changed documentation to have gender-neutral pronouns, and there was some back and forth with the lead dev about not making “political” statements. Also lead dev is German and apparently (just what I have been told) in German the male pronouns are used when making gender-neutral references; so that muddied the waters of the back and forth - he may have assumed he was doing intended grammar in English and others may have assumed he was fighting against inclusivity (which as been going around a lot lately, in case that was not obvious…)

As far as I know it was eventually straightened out and the changes were implemented

[–] groet@feddit.org 9 points 1 week ago

German here: in german all nouns have a gender. and virtually all nouns used to describe people in general are male (like user, human, citizen) and a majority of professions as well. As such using male pronouns in documentation is common as you refer to a user (and the word user has male gender). However there is a big debate in Germany about gender inclusive language that moves away from this "generic masculinity" of nouns. And of course the political left is pro inclusivity while the right is against it.

So if a (german) dev is actively defending the use of male-only pronouns they probably fall into the anti-invlusive-language camp in Germany as well. Its reasonable they would make the mistake when just translating from German, but starting a fight over changing it is sus.

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[–] Okaydystopia@beehaw.org 9 points 1 week ago

Will ladybird be the Linux of my disappointment, or the Cinnamon of my dreams?

[–] fdnomad@programming.dev 7 points 1 week ago

Looking forward to try it in Summer 2026. I hope long term theres going to be support for uBO, separating sessions, and maybe jxl :')

[–] RedGreenBlue@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Sounds cool! Is it in a useful state?

[–] percent 16 points 1 week ago

No, but there are monthly updates on their YouTube channel, and they've made great progress!

[–] shaytan@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 1 week ago

It's going through some good breakthroughs, I for example can now use proton mail on it, but it's not in a daily usable state

They are aiming for an alpha in 2026, beta in 2027, and release 2028

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