this post was submitted on 05 Oct 2025
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TechTakes

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Big brain tech dude got yet another clueless take over at HackerNews etc? Here's the place to vent. Orange site, VC foolishness, all welcome.

This is not debate club. Unless it’s amusing debate.

For actually-good tech, you want our NotAwfulTech community

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Want to wade into the sandy surf of the abyss? Have a sneer percolating in your system but not enough time/energy to make a whole post about it? Go forth and be mid: Welcome to the Stubsack, your first port of call for learning fresh Awful you’ll near-instantly regret.

Any awful.systems sub may be subsneered in this subthread, techtakes or no.

If your sneer seems higher quality than you thought, feel free to cut’n’paste it into its own post — there’s no quota for posting and the bar really isn’t that high.

The post Xitter web has spawned soo many “esoteric” right wing freaks, but there’s no appropriate sneer-space for them. I’m talking redscare-ish, reality challenged “culture critics” who write about everything but understand nothing. I’m talking about reply-guys who make the same 6 tweets about the same 3 subjects. They’re inescapable at this point, yet I don’t see them mocked (as much as they should be)

Like, there was one dude a while back who insisted that women couldn’t be surgeons because they didn’t believe in the moon or in stars? I think each and every one of these guys is uniquely fucked up and if I can’t escape them, I would love to sneer at them.

(Credit and/or blame to David Gerard for starting this.)

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[–] flaviat@awful.systems 11 points 1 week ago

Just here to note that @dgerard had a clippy pfp before it was cool

[–] antifuchs@awful.systems 11 points 1 week ago (5 children)

Think I’ve taken psychic damage reading this about moldbug contemplating leaving the country https://fxbsky.app/profile/helldude.bsky.social/post/3m2hltni4422n

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[–] rook@awful.systems 10 points 1 week ago (4 children)

Mercifully image-free article from rolling stone on how easy it is becoming to get grok to generate porn, including deepfakes of real people and bestiality.

https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/elon-musk-grok-hardcore-porn-1235442715

Includes a relevant quote from musk back in august:

https://xcancel.com/elonmusk/status/1954791048934244394

I still remember 6th/7th grade debates with classmates about VHS vs Betamax!

VHS won in the end, in part because they allowed spicy mode 😉

I guess that’s a product “moat” of sorts.

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[–] froztbyte@awful.systems 10 points 1 week ago (2 children)

haven't finished reading this so no sneers yet, but others may also be interested in this piece on the history of thiel's antichrist obsession

the opener probably won't surprise you

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[–] BlueMonday1984@awful.systems 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Found a pretty good sneer against vibe coding: The Programmer Identity Crisis

[–] istewart@awful.systems 11 points 1 week ago (4 children)

This author touches on a point that dovetails with my thinking:

Dijkstra, in “On the foolishness of ‘natural language programming’,” wrote, rather poignantly: “We have to challenge the assumptions that natural languages would simplify work.” And: “The virtue of formal texts is that their manipulation, in order to be legitimate, need to satisfy only a few simple rules; they are, when you come to think of it, an amazingly effective tool for ruling out all sorts of nonsense that, when we use our native tongues, are almost impossible to avoid.”

I think it likely that these tools will not be judged, in the long term, by the ambitions and hopes of the AGI cultists and hype-men, but by comparison to the many other attempts at natural-language programming in English. Smalltalk, Visual Basic, I even want to throw in AppleScript, as simple and threadbare as it was. How are all of these doing now?

AppleScript has been complemented or perhaps superseded by at least two more graphically-oriented attempts at system automation targeted at non-technical users. One could argue that its falloff came from an imperfect marriage with the message-passing/service-oriented architecture based on Objective-C and inherited from NeXT in Mac OS X, a system design which is itself now vestigial. The comparison with LLM coding assistants is imperfect, as they seem to be typically targeted at the more granular level of the class or the method, rather than explicit high-level hooks in an application. A better comparison here would be the last year or so worth of "AI agents," but, uhm, ahh...

Smalltalk seemed to have a pretty big boom in the late 80s/early 90s, but tapered off rapidly after that. I like the more modern implementation of Pharo well enough, but it strives to throw in everything and the kitchen sink, with a downright balk-worthy amount of packages listed when you open up the class browser. On top of that, a few weeks ago I noticed someone in their Discord telling a newbie that current good practice is to file out your code every once in a while and then start over with a fresh image, as various background processes in stock images typically become unstable over time. This is orthogonal to the natural-language-like design, but it is a stumbling block to the sense of "liveness" and interactivity that is similarly a big hook for LLM assistance. Furthermore, as far as I know, they still don't have a stable answer for system-level parallelism in the VM. All I've seen is a rather awkward technique for spinning off tree-shaken child VMs if there's some method you want to run in parallel. You've got to really love Smalltalk to want to work past that shortcoming!

VB.NET I can't really speak to, except that it seems Microsoft now considers it a stable language with little if any new feature development. The original implementation never seemed to have a good rep for maintainability, and the very idea of native Forms seems out of fashion compared to JavaScript web-app frontends. And the land of JavaScript, of course, seems to be the most fertile and uncontested kingdom of LLM coding assistance. I'm genuinely interested to hear more experiences with modern VB, as it strikes me as the last great corporate-sanctioned push for non-technical users to build their own apps, and thus the most worthy comparison.

All this is to say that each of these previous attempts at natural-language programming haven't bit-rotted too hard, implementations are still available and you can probably salvage a legacy project with some effort. But each of them have been sidelined by industry over time. Not necessarily because of Dijkstra's objection to the ambition of approaching natural language, although I don't think we can totally discount that as a factor. But other technical or platform restrictions certainly hamstrung each of them. And LLM tools are still mostly API-based SaaS, which always has the glaring technical vulnerability of the provider running out of money. Yes, people will still pursue local models, but the bubble bursting could do a lot more harm to this approach than proponents anticipate.

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[–] gerikson@awful.systems 9 points 1 week ago (8 children)

Is it just me or does it feel there's a concerted effort to boost the AT protocol in tech venues? Maybe I'm paranoid but it does feel like a bit of openwashing going on.

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[–] Seminar2250@awful.systems 9 points 1 week ago (3 children)

after playing silksong and hades ii, i am now pretty confident that game devs sniff their farts more than any other artists

"the player can't pause during the boss because he controls time" fuck offfffff

(hades ii is mostly excellent, though, and silksong is a diamond encased in dogshit


there is a wonderful game in there, if you can find it)

That sounds really neat for all of 30 seconds before your cat knocks over their water bowl mid-fight and needs your immediate attention, thus reminding you why pause functions exist at all.

[–] hrrrngh@awful.systems 8 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Gotta love forgetting why games have these features in the first place, so accessibility features get viewed as boring stuff you need to subvert and spice up. also reminds me of how many games used to (and continue to) include filters for simulating colorblindness as actual accessibility settings because all the other games did that. Like adding a "Deaf Accessibility" setting that mutes the audio.

Demon Souls didn't have a pause mechanic (maybe because of technical or matchmaking problems, who knows), so clearly hard games must lack a functioning pause feature to be good. Simple. The less pause that you button, the more Soulsier it that Elden when Demon the it you Ring. Our epic new boss is so hard he actually reads the state of the tinnitus filter in your accessibility settings, and then he

[–] mii@awful.systems 7 points 1 week ago (1 children)

You probably already know this, but there's a relatively cheap upgrade you can buy at the camp in Hades II that disables this mechanic. Forgot what it's called, but it's something like "Allows you to use time magic against the boss".

[–] Seminar2250@awful.systems 7 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

I bought it before I ever paused against the boss. I discovered this mechanic doing Vow of Rivals :(

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[–] rook@awful.systems 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Mildly interesting thread about the progress of blacksky: https://bsky.app/profile/did:plc:w4xbfzo7kqfes5zb7r6qv3rw/post/3m2n62lzbeu2p

They’re aiming for full independence from bluesky, which is a laudable goal though not one they’ve achieved yet. They’re currently getting a reasonable amount of user funding rather than being a typical vc furnace (https://opencollective.com/blacksky) but I’m not sure what their plan is for moderation which is what will carry the project in the long term. I’d like to say it can’t be worse than bluesky, but moderation at scale is a nightmare.

[–] mawhrin@awful.systems 9 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

one nice thing is that the migration process to the bluesky is painless and straightforward. if we had the ability to not only take our toots (export does exist) but also move them to a new mastodon server, that would be a very nice boon for the fediverse. (it's also one of the oldest open tickets in mastodon's github issues. and yes, i know of slurp, but that's not really frictionless.)

[–] blakestacey@awful.systems 9 points 1 week ago (1 children)
[–] froztbyte@awful.systems 10 points 1 week ago

I am jack’s completely and utterly unsurprised face

[–] Soyweiser@awful.systems 8 points 1 week ago

Replacement Antinatalism. By Émile P. Torres. Having babies is unethical, having AI babies otoh is the way forward.

Turns out the abyss is even deeper than we thought. Give it a look.

[–] nfultz@awful.systems 8 points 1 week ago (1 children)
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