this post was submitted on 22 Nov 2023
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Like the title says, I'm new to self hosting world. πŸ˜€ while I was researching, I found out that many people dissuaded me to self host email server. Just too complicated and hard to manage. What other services that you think we should just go use the currently available providers in the market and why? πŸ™‚thank you

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[–] gpzj94@alien.top 4 points 2 years ago
[–] HTTP_404_NotFound@alien.top 3 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Don't host your own email server.

Just trust me.

[–] KN4MKB@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Meh, been doing it for 5 years now with minimal issues. Had one issue come up where my domain was flagged as malicious, but was solved in a few days and some emails to security vendors.

I think it's important that those who can, and are educated enough to keep it running properly do host their own. Hosting your own email should be encouraged if capable because it helps reduce the monopoly, and keep a little bit of power for those who want to retain email privacy.

[–] rad2018@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago

I agree with KN4MKB. I've been hosting my own mail server for decades. Not one issue. I use that in lieu of a mail service provider (Google immediately comes to mind), as their EULA service agreement will tell you that - since you're using their service, on their servers - anything goes. Read the fine print on Gmail, and you'll see. πŸ˜‰

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[–] Im1Random@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I did it anyway some time ago and I'm really happy with it. I'm using my own email addresses for absolutely anything by now.

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In my opinion, cloud storage for (zero knowledge) backup. Your backup strategy should include a diversity of physical locations. I had a house fire a few years ago. Luckily, my data drives survived, but if they hadn't, my cloud backup would've been invaluable.

[–] rgnissen202@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago

I'd say backups. At least it shouldn't be only local. I follow the rule of threes: two local copies and one off site with backblaze. Yeah, it ties up a not insignificant amount of disk space I could use for other things, but dammit, I'm not loosing my wedding photos, important system configurations, etc.

[–] shrugal@lemm.ee 2 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

People saying email, look into using external SMTP servers as relays. Your domain most likely comes with at least one email account with SMTP access. You can use that as a relay to send personal/business emails from your server using the provider's reputable IP addresses.

Passwords:
-> You want to have immediat access to them, even if your house burns down

Notes:
-> You want to be able to read the documentation how to fix your selfhosted service, even when your selfhosted services are down

Public Reverse proxy:
-> A reverse proxy is only as safe as the applications behind. And NO, most selfhosted-applications are not hardened or had security audits
(reverse proxy with a forward authentication proxy is something different)

[–] bulletproofkoala@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Okay I understand that email hosting is bad for SENDING email , but what about only RECEIVING email , isn’t it a good idea to keep my stuff private ? I rarely send personal emails, and like to avoid my data being used for marketing purposes Is that bad to have smtp imap open on dynamic ip address ? Just asking your opinion

[–] 0rsted@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Antispam is hell, just saying

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[–] GolemancerVekk@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Don't self-host email SMTP or public DNS. They're hard to set up properly, hard to maintain, easy to compromise and end up used in internet attacks.

Don't expose anything directly to the internet if you're not willing to constantly monitor the vulnerability announcements, update to new releases as soon as they come out, monitor the container for intrusions and shenanigans, take the risk that the constant updates will break something etc. If you must expose a service use a VPN (Tailscale is very easy to set up and use.)

Don't self-host anything with important data that takes uber-geek skills to maintain and access. Ask yourself, if you were to die suddenly, how screwed would your non-tech-savvy family be, who can't tell a Linux server from a hot plate? Would they be able to keep functioning (calendar, photos, documents etc.) without constant maintenance? Can they still retrieve their files (docs, pics) with only basic computing skills? Can they migrate somewhere else when the server runs down?

[–] Vogete@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

A password manager because if anything goes wrong, you'll be completely screwed.

What you SHOULD absolutely self host though is a password manager, so you can be in control of your most sensitive data.

Regarding email, I think everyone should absolutely self host it, but it's less and less viable in this google/Microsoft duopoly world. But ideally everyone would self host it. The reason why people advise against it really comes down to lack of real competition, and the two tech giants dictating how we violate every RFC possible.

[–] pogky_thunder@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago

A password manager because if anything goes wrong, you'll be completely screwed.

What you SHOULD absolutely self host though is a password manager, so you can be in control of your most sensitive data.

Wot?

[–] paulsmithkc@alien.top 2 points 2 years ago

Primary backups

[–] audero@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Password manager. While some may cache on your client devices, by and large if your server goes down, no passwords.

[–] ElDubsNZ@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Vaultwarden is perfect for that then, it does cache locally.

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[–] ProfessionalAd3026@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (3 children)
[–] Zip95014@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Not entirely true. All new OSX's have content cache. Basically a home CDN for apple stuff.

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[–] Accomplished-Lack721@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

The login page to your NAS.

[–] KN4MKB@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (3 children)

If your NAS is properly updated, and SSL is used, then the login screen it just as safe as any other web app with regular updates. I would ask why someone would want that.

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[–] Diligent_Ad_9060@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Some generic purpose LLM probably.

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[–] Simplixt@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

E-Mail.

And maybe unpopular opinion:

  1. Any service that you use with port-forwarding, besides WireGuard.
    I would never access any self-hosted application without VPN.

  2. Password manager. I want to minimize complexity with my most important data (that's why I'm using KeePass instead of Self-Hosted Bitwarden).

[–] xerker@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Aside from other stuff mentioned here about email. I always assumed I'd become a target for spam that I'd have a harder time filtering out to the point it stops being worth it to have a custom email address.

That and I can almost guarantee I would end up screwing up the backup of my inbox and losing everything rending the whole endeavour pointless.

[–] Cheesecaketree@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

surprisingly my custom email address gets by far the least amount of spam. I had maybe 20 spam mails over the last year. Meanwhile my gmail address sometimes gets that every single day lol

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[–] JaJe92@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (7 children)

Clearly opening RDP port on internet. NEVER.

[–] teem@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Lol, I work at an attack surface scanning company. Every freaking company I talk to, with very few exceptions, has at least one of these. If not a whole infrastructure. Then they cry, "how did we get ransomware?"

[–] vkapadia@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (4 children)

What is wrong with that? Don't they still need correct credentials to connect?

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[–] FlockSystem@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (4 children)

What do you mean by "clearly". Open RDP without password protection?

I often use RDP to access my desktop Windows 10.

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[–] JoeB-@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Choosing a service to NOT selfhost is a subjective descision.

I host 18 Proxmox VMs and 20 Docker containers at home. I also was selfhosting a WebDAV server for synchronizing my Joplin notes between devices and Vaultwarden for managing my Bitwarden vault, but decided to push the Joplin synchronization target to Dropbox [free] and to use Bitwarden's free cloud solution for my passwords and secure notes. I did this because I will need immediate access to these two critical sources of information should my house burn down, or get blown over by a tornado. I have extremely strong passcodes for these and trust the hosts.

This was strictly a personal decision. YMMV.

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[–] therealsimontemplar@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (3 children)

I’ve seen far too many compromised Wordpress installations to ever consider installing it in my home dmz.

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[–] timawesomeness@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Internet-accessible authoritative DNS nameserver(s) (unless you have a completely static public IP).

[–] Tivin-i@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Any public facing service that other (services) depend on should not be running on a public IP (especially ones that translate addresses, and ones you have to manually update).

You could run an authoritative NS "hidden" where only your secondary NS can reach out to for zone transfers. You could also escape having a public IP if you configure rsync or scripts to update secodary host files on every IP change.

[–] grobouletdu33@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Mail server, too many troubles related to domaine name blocking/ban, good for internal network/VPN use but not for anything serious

[–] bbyboi@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago
[–] RedFive1976@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Mail server or anything using RDP.

[–] r4nchy@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)
[–] HecateRaven@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm doing it on a bm I rent for 10 years now without issues with spf, dmarc, dkim and everything from scratch (no docker bloat)

[–] TBT_TBT@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Docker is the antithesis of β€žbloatβ€œ.

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[–] miteycasey@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

I think there's a hangup on the term "self-host" where some people are assuming it's going to be exposed to the Internet.

I self-host a ton of stuff that is only available inside my home network or through my VPN, which is not publicly discoverable. I would never open a TCP port to the world from my home network. That's how you end up on shodan.

So yeah, if it has to accept inbound connections from arbitrary other systems on the dirty internet (email, mastodon, etc), it's not happening on my network, and probably not at all because it's a pain in the ass to stay patched.

[–] borg286@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago

Push notifications.

It is fine hosting a service that gets requests then talks to FCM or the iOS version. But a service that one's phone stays connected to 24/7 is really hard, and not kill one's battery.

[–] zfa@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I don't self host anything where it would impact me unduly if it went down while I was on holiday to the point where I'd have to break state and go fix stuff.

I don't want to have to leave my beer or beach and head off to fix things like an email server, restore a password manager db etc. so anything like that which is critical to the point where an outage would prob have me do so means I pay someone else.

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[–] Carilion@alien.top 1 points 2 years ago
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