For those also learning about Yuzu thanks only to Nintendo's lawsuit, let's save you a search:
this post was submitted on 28 Feb 2024
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Is it just the Linux 64 version of yuzu that you use for steam deck, or is it a different one?
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not sure if they have a case, even if lawful uses of it are very rare, it doesn't mean the software itself is illegal (pretty sure this kind of thing has been settled in court before)
At least here in the states reverse engineering is totally legal. So generally emulators are legal to build. That said Nintendo can and will make their life difficult regardless of whether or not the emulator itself is taken down
This time around, Nintendo is arguing that by using prod.keys, Yuzu is a copyright protection circumvention product in violation of 17 USC §1201 (a)(2).
No person shall manufacture, import, offer to the public, provide, or otherwise traffic in any technology, product, service, device, component, or part thereof, that—
(A) is primarily designed or produced for the purpose of circumventing a technological measure that effectively controls access to a work protected under this title;
(B) has only limited commercially significant purpose or use other than to circumvent a technological measure that effectively controls access to a work protected under this title; or
(C) is marketed by that person or another acting in concert with that person with that person’s knowledge for use in circumventing a technological measure that effectively controls access to a work protected under this title.
The reverse engineering protection under the DMCA only applies to 17 USC §1201 (a)(1)(A), so there's a very real and very scary possibility of Nintendo winning this one and setting a precedent if they can convince a judge that Yuzu's is primarily for DRM circumvention.
Yuzu doesn't ship with prod.keys. You need to provide them from your legally ripped switch. And the guides outline that (https://yuzu-emu.org/help/quickstart/#dumping-decryption-keys). Nintendo needs to go after sites that provide those keys, not Yuzu...
Yuzu doesn't provide them... Yuzu goes out of it's way to tell you how to get them legally. I'm not sure that Yuzu has circumvented anything.
Nintendo could have a claim against tools like Hekate, since that's the tool that has to decrypt stuff to dump it. But I'm not sure that would fly either.
The interesting part of this lawsuit is that it doesn't matter whether Yuzu provides prod.keys or not. Nintendo is going after them for using the keys to decrypt things, framing the emulator itself as being a Switch DRM circumvention tool.
That‘s the thing with huge, shitty corporations. Even when they know they‘re absolutely in the wrong, they can still go after the small fishes and make their lives hell.
To give another example, LEGO has been flooding small toy sellers in Germany with cease and desist letters for selling sets from competitors that might look like knock-offs to some, but are perfectly legal because LEGO does not own the brick system. And of course they would never go after Amazon for doing the exact same. Only small sellers that are ruined if they can‘t scrape the money together for a proper legal defense.
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What worries me is they think they have a case. Nintendo isn't dumb. And they have known about Yuzu for a long time. Something must have changed recently that made them think this would be worth it.
Just being an expensive pain to the developer dissuades future developers.
Why now then? Why not a couple years ago when Valve teased that you could use Yuzu on the Steam Deck?
They do specify cite the Tears of the Kingdom release and increasing revenue to Yuzu, maybe that motivated them more.
Anyway I don’t mean they certainly have no case. We'll see.
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Nintendo has lost this type of case before. Their strategy is usually to drain the defendant of cash.
Typical Nintendo move. So sad to see Yuzu possibly going down this way. Even looks like Nintendo might win this one. I'm just gonna download the entire source from GitHub just in case.
I wish this would just go full hydra mode if it goes down though. Start popping up new anonymous accounts releasing the source code everywhere.
Of course the source code stays available somehow. What's more important to Nintendo is that further development stops. At least on the scale it is right now
Can't development just be moved out of the US? Like in my country even downloading copyrighted materials isn't a crime, only uploading so emulators are like double legal.
Where is that? Asking for a friend.
Most of South America.
Brazil, for instance, tacitly encourages piracy. Because foreign media is too expensive for locals to be able to regularly afford it, so the entire country’s foreign media consumption is basically fueled by content piracy. It’s sort of an open secret, where everyone just openly downloads or streams pirated content and the government doesn’t give a fuck.
Australia. Not sure if it counts for everything, but AFAIK for movies pirating them is okay as long as you're not sharing (i.e. uploading, seeding, etc.) and it's for personal use.
story as old as time...nintendo sues * insert piracy/emulation/gameplay video*
Thank you, Barbra Streisand-san.
There's a Switch Emulator? Sweet!
Even better, there's two!
Ryujinx and Yuzu are both competent emulators even though the Switch is Nintendo's current console
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Cry and seethe, Nintendo.
I hate nintendo. I know a lot of ppl that plays the game with their our bought copies all legal on pc just because it RUNS BETTER. Nintendo....
Yeah that’s me. I owned the games on switch first, then later played them on PC because they ran better and I could mod them. But Ninty is arguing that since playing the games requires encryption keys from a legitimate Switch, that the emulator is impossible to play legally. Because they argue that the act of extracting those encryption keys is illegal, so using them to play your own games is also illegal.
Never mind the fact that you already own the console, and therefore own the keys that are stored on the console. But Nintendo basically argues that buying the console and the game only gives you a license to play the game on a legitimate console using the licensed keys, so emulation is a violation of that software license and the DMCA.
It’s a piss poor argument. But with the way the courts are stacked these days, they may actually win. And if they win, the precedent could have horrible implications for any emulation later than the PS2/GameCube generation.
Just because it's not lawful (according to them) don't mean it's not a good idea.
Maybe if their Switch was priced better and games were cheaper, I'd get one.
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...so if I wanted to test my Switch game before I apply for a proper dev kit i'm now officially shit out of luck? Thanks, Nintendo!
Correct. They want you to buy a dev kit for $450.
Just downloaded a copy this morning.
Good thing there is still ryujinx
For now
I think yuzu is associated with more piracy because FitGirl et al include it in their pirate releases for games with Denuvo
I'll be shocked if they're not next.
If you would like to support the Yuzu Team, there is an Early Access Yuzu App on the Play Store
Man, maybe if nintendo didnt keep siccing lawyers on everyone for everything (including themselves in their infinite geeneeus) maybe they wouldnt be having these imaginary financial hardships that they want to blame piracy on.
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