this post was submitted on 09 Aug 2023

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Work Reform

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A place to discuss positive changes that can make work more equitable, and to vent about current practices. We are NOT against work; we just want the fruits of our labor to be recognized better.

Our Philosophies:

All workers must be paid a living wage for their labor.
Income inequality is the main cause of lower living standards.
Workers must join together and fight back for what is rightfully theirs.
We must not be divided and conquered. Workers gain the most when they focus on unifying issues.

Our Goals

Higher wages for underpaid workers.
Better worker representation, including but not limited to unions.
Better and fewer working hours.
Stimulating a massive wave of worker organizing in the United States and beyond.
Organizing and supporting political causes and campaigns that put workers first.

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Push For A 4-Day Work Week Picks Up Steam — And Critics (www.foxnews.com)

submitted 2 years ago by walnutwalrus@lemmy.world to c/workreform@lemmy.world

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[–] givesomefucks@lemmy.world 123 points 2 years ago (2 children)

When humans went to a six day work week, the wealthy said it would end civilization.

When we went to a five day work week, they said the same.

Same as when we said overtime needs more pay, women should be paid more, 9 year olds can't work in coal mines, and basically every other labor law from the past 10,000 years.

Don't know why people still listen to them

[–] just_change_it@lemmy.world 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What do you mean? The world will END If us rich people get less of a % share of the pie! MORE SHARES OF THE PROFITS FOR THE FEW!!!!!1111oneone

^/s^

[–] orrk@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

is man not entitled to the sweat of his brow? and the sweat of the brows he lords over as a neo-feudal capitalist?

[–] Rolive@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 2 years ago

And we are more productive than ever due to automation. I bet 2 days would be enough to keep society running. Nothing fancy though. 3 would be enough for economic growth.

Anything more is just to make oligarchs richer.

[+] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 43 points 2 years ago (7 children)

[removed by mod]

[–] TheGiantKorean@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago

I used to do 4 10s, from 6am til 4pm. It wasn't horrible. But 4 8s would be so much better.

[–] TheUsualButBlaBlaBla@lemmy.world 6 points 2 years ago

I do 4x10 and it’s a joy - for me. I can work from home when I want and 10 hours flies by when you know you have a 3 day weekend to look forward to at the end. I’m definitely more focused and productive.

[–] just_change_it@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Keep in mind the typical office commute can be very long. Let's say 1.5 hours each day (45 minutes there, 45 minutes back.)

8.5 hour day (unpaid 30 min lunch) + 1.5 hour commute = 10 hours from leaving home until arriving home. 5 days a week = 50 hours total for work in a 5 day work week.

10.5 hour day (unpaid 30 minute lunch) + 1.5 hour commute = 12 hours from leaving home until arriving home. 4 days a week = 48 hours total for work in a 4 day work week.

You work less. Odds are with a longer shift you also avoid rush hour on one side of it, so the 10 hour work week loses another hour or two. It's a BIG win. You get an extra 10 hours of fully conscious time on an extra day of the week which is HUGE for personal hobbies, enjoyment, family time - you name it. For me approaching 40, getting home from work I have almost no energy for personal activities after chores each day. Add on children and you get even less time aside from grinding.

Good news is that the 5 day work week will NEVER go away, so you will always have the choice of working five days and only getting two days off while your buddies take the extra day each week :)

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If a ton of people take the 10x4 schedule, then there will just be a new rush hour. And the problem is working 10 hours a day, not working 4 days a week. This isn't the 19th century. The idea that we even need to work 40 hours a week is playing into the hands of the capitalist oligarchs. They want you to be happy dong 10x4 and not, for example, 8x4 or 6x5. They think the more you work, the more productive you are when that's utter bullshit and it just wears people out.

[–] just_change_it@lemmy.world 0 points 2 years ago

If a ton of people take the 10x4 schedule, then there will just be a new rush hour.

If there was a universal "Friday off for everyone" this could be possible but Saturdays and Sundays are work days for a big portion of people. I don't think it could ever happen, instead you'd just have schedules with coverage. Billy gets Monday off, Sally gets Tuesday off, etc etc.

They want you to be happy dong 10x4 and not, for example, 8x4 or 6x5. The thought of working 6x5 is maddening to me. I GREATLY value full days off and I never take partial days off even though I could easily take 2 hours off a day for several months a year. At least a couple of hours of work a day are bullshit but that's just my Job, many others have nonstop work where they never get to stop aside from brief break periods which are closely monitored.

I don't disagree that many jobs could easily be part time to the tune of 20hours/week or even less and be fine but if you're in any kind of critical role - take almost any job that was in person throughout the pandemic - there's just no way to not staff people during those hours.

If the idea of happy employees working short shifts or fewer days paid off for companies they would do it because money is #1. I don't want to kid anyone. The benefit here is employees at effectively no benefit to the employers, so they have zero incentive to do it even if it doesn't help them whatsoever. Already it's nearly impossible to accurately gauge performance in countless roles but the idea that an ass isn't in a chair is a hard habit to break for some people, my boss included.

[–] PRUSSIA_x86@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

I used to work 9:30a-8p four days a week and it was actually a pretty sweet gig. I did nothing but work and sleep for four days, then had three days off every weekend.

[–] IGuessThisIsMyName@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago

I did it for 4 years while my son was very young. I loved it and would return to it if not for school hours. 6am to 4pm worked really well and having 3 days off meant some great family time.

My wife did a 4 day week too and we offset our days so that our son only needed 3 days in daycare during the week.

[–] ma11en@lemmy.world 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I do 4 on 4 off, 4x12hr days then 4x12hr nights, the 4 off is excellent.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

That would kill me.

[–] ma11en@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

I used to work 5x10hr and it was so much worse, currently I have 2 days off and then my weekend starts again.

[–] randon31415@lemmy.world 15 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Then there is me, a professor, who works every day because students do homework on weekends and need help. I figure instead of a 4x10, I am doing a 7x5.

[–] hark@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I hope you're not a professor of mathematics.

[–] randon31415@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Why, it is the others that don't know I'm working 5 hours less...

[–] hark@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago

Oh, never mind then LOL

[–] Darkwatch00@lemmy.world 14 points 2 years ago

I will never give up my 3 on 4 off in the hospital. It's long sometimes but damn does 4 days off feel good.

[–] criitz@lemmy.world 13 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

"Companies need to produce the same level of work, so they may need to hire and train more people. Would the tax breaks offered be enough to cover these extra expenses? This could cause businesses to really sweat."

It's funny how the criticism is basically "But this will create more jobs!"

[–] OwenEverbinde@lemmy.myserv.one 10 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

I also can't help but notice how her personification of businesses (as things that can "really sweat") and empathy for them far exceeds the level at which she humanizes workers.

It's almost like "Mary Elizabeth Elkordy, founder of the remote-based company Elkordy Global Strategies," has a keen sense for which team she belongs to.

[–] ristoril_zip@lemmy.zip 9 points 2 years ago

It's gonna be middle managers and owners criticizing. The former because they add no value, the latter because... oh they add no value either, but they also profit off our work. But they're afraid their lack of value adding will be discovered.

[–] CoolSouthpaw@lemmy.world 8 points 2 years ago

Fuck those piece of shit critics!

[–] notabird@lemmy.world 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Can't even work from home right now. These things won't happen anytime in the near future.

[–] kameecoding@lemmy.world 3 points 2 years ago

it's entirely job dependent, a grocery store worker can't just decide they will not work one of the days anymore because the store needs to be open. but they work in shifts and different days already.

There will also be white collar jobs that can't just move to a different schedule, like support needs to be everyday regardless.

and if you are a software engineer there is a good chance you are already working remote and if you are good enough you are only working the days you want to.