this post was submitted on 10 Mar 2026
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TenForward: Where Every Vulcan Knows Your Name

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[–] Blackmist@feddit.uk 4 points 47 minutes ago (2 children)

And not just natives (who are invariably human shaped), they often have entire databases of info on them from presumably when they were "discovered".

Mass Effect was a better sci fi universe and I'll die on that hill.

[–] rustydrd@sh.itjust.works 3 points 31 minutes ago

I don't even think many people will disagree with that. The appealing thing about Star Trek was always the utopia, the idealism, the philosophical questions, and (in some cases) the sciency details. Most attempts to make Star Trek into some kind of uber-galactic-struggle-between-alien-races or quest-to-avoid-the-destruction-of-the-universe that were the focus of many later sci-fi shows ended up making it worse.

As fully fledged sci-fi universes that were explicitly written with these "big" stories in mind, Mass Effect or The Expanse are clearly ahead.

[–] Thebeardedsinglemalt@lemmy.world 1 points 4 minutes ago

Kinda like how Columbus "discovered" America, despite a shitton of natives here and evidence Vikings and other explorers also landed here?

[–] s@piefed.world 1 points 15 minutes ago

The people who were already there didn’t go there if they were always there

[–] WoodScientist@lemmy.world 4 points 1 hour ago

Eh. You don't have to be the first person to discover something to discover it. This is what people always miss with the vapid line about Columbus not discovering the Americas. Sure, there were already people there. But the vast majority of the human population in 1492 was ignorant of the very existence of the American continents. And their discovery instituted an epochal change that upended both the Americas and the old world.

We can condemn genocide and displacement without becoming pedantic gotcha warriors.

If all that matters is the first person to discover something, no scientist in human history has ever discovered anything. After all, relativity was probably first discovered 5 billion years ago by some alien physicist living several galaxies away.

[–] lakemalcom@sh.itjust.works 20 points 3 hours ago (3 children)

It was a list:

  • to explore strange new worlds
  • seek out new life and new civilizations
  • boldly go where no one has gone before
[–] hakunawazo@lemmy.world 10 points 2 hours ago

Boldly yes, but It's been a long road gettin' from there to here.

[–] DagwoodIII@piefed.social 52 points 5 hours ago (2 children)

TOS came out at a time when people still talked of Columbus discovering america.

which makes no sense, because even then, we knew Columbus wasn't the first person there.

[–] aeronmelon@lemmy.world 34 points 5 hours ago (6 children)

TOS came out at a time when Columbus was still being held in high regard. :)

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[–] dontbelievethis@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

You don't have to go where you already are.

[–] Kolanaki@pawb.social 1 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

Using warp engines, you don't really go anywhere; you bring the other place to you! 😃

[–] ParlimentOfDoom@piefed.zip 1 points 3 minutes ago

Aren't you moving the specific Where you are occupying to somewhere else?

[–] LaLuzDelSol@lemmy.world 28 points 5 hours ago (3 children)

I mean the original line was "where no man has gone before" which at least made sense, although it didn't represent the female crew very well.

Goes into the women's bathroom because I really have to shit and the men's has been occupied for 20 minutes

[–] DagwoodIII@piefed.social 48 points 5 hours ago (6 children)

English uses 'man' and 'mankind' interchangeably.

Grammatically, 'no man' makes more sense than 'no one.'

[–] LaLuzDelSol@lemmy.world 3 points 2 hours ago

Yeah I don't disagree, but that is still why they changed it. Using "man" to refer to all mankind (and even "mankind" for that matter) is going out of style.

[–] The_Picard_Maneuver@piefed.world 16 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago) (4 children)

I've always thought it was an odd change. I get why they did it, but the original clearly wasn't being used in the way the change implies.

It has the same energy as saying that you can't use the term "whitelist" and must substitute "allowlist", or "master bedroom" to "primary bedroom", or that time they changed "monkeypox" to "m-pox".

[–] cattywampas@lemmy.world 6 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

"Master bedroom" being changed is such a silly one. That term wasn't even used until the 20th century and referred to the master of the household. It has nothing to do with slave masters.

It speaks to a larger cultural ignorance or poor literacy to even consider it, in my opinion. I've seen similar reactions to talking about "plantation-style" home architecture. It's as if many people have only ever heard these words in connection with slavery from their lessons in school.

[–] EncryptKeeper@lemmy.world 7 points 4 hours ago (11 children)

Yeah it’s be hard to argue TOS was excluding women in that sentence given the presence of female bridge crew members.

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[–] VitoRobles@lemmy.today 15 points 5 hours ago

"I am no man!" Says the female crew, who proceeds to stab the space Nazgul in the eye.

[–] titanicx@lemmy.zip 6 points 4 hours ago (7 children)

White version of discovery. 

I have discovered this place! But we live here already. Nope, I'm the first to discover it! 

[–] minorkeys@lemmy.world 0 points 42 minutes ago* (last edited 30 minutes ago) (1 children)

Discovery is relative to perspective of the explorer, it is not a characteristic of what is explored. A person can be an explorer, a group, a society, a people can be the explorer on behalf of the group. All of humanity was not the group those explorers were exploring on behalf of.

You have to have some kind of racist perspective in you to claim that it is a white person issue. It is absolutely certain that individuals and groups had, and continue to have, similar concepts of discovery on behalf of their people or themselves, even if other people already knew of a thing. "Look what I found." Is literally that. If someone else knew about the thing, was it actually found since it wasn't really lost if anyone else knew already?

That said, from a perspective relative to humanity as a whole, no, white people didn't discover many things first, but it's relative to themselves and the people who learn of it from them. White people discovered the Americas for themselves and for most of the rest of the world. While First Nations were the first to make the discovery, that knowledge not being shared means others had to discover it as well. White people discovered the Americas and shared that knowledge with the rest of humanity so while not the first to discover the Americans they were the only ones who did who informed the rest of humanity, meaning they discovered it on behalf of most human beings and in doing so, get a relatively larger amount of credit for it. They absolutely did discover the Americas, they just weren't the first humans to do so.

[–] titanicx@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 minutes ago

No white people discovered the Americas and shared it with other white people not humanity. I'm pretty sure the millions of indigenous people that lived here also counts as humanity and they didn't share it with any of the other people that are had already been visiting the Americas such as the Asian culture and hell even the Russian culture and the Nordic culture themselves had already been visiting the Americas far before Columbus and any of his idiotic people showed up here. 

And no you don't have to have any sort of racist belief to understand that these idiots were going through and doing everything that they were doing as far as taking the land saying that it's theirs and saying that they discovered it. You just have to have a slight understanding of exactly how history has played out.

Here's a fun one: Columbus is also credited with discovering the concept of magnetic declination (the difference between true and magnetic North.) In his logs, he noted that his compass had become somewhat misaligned with the North star. He was the first Western European to write about this, but it had been known since antiquity by those sailing the Indian ocean. But none of that was done by people who wrote in the Latin alphabet.

[–] cattywampas@lemmy.world 4 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

It does bring up the point that "discovery" can also be a relative term.

Astronomer: I have discovered a kuiper belt object that no one has ever seen or detected before.

Archaeologist: I have discovered a chamber in the Great Pyramid that, while built by humans who could read and write, nobody has known about since the invention of the saddle.

CIA goon: I have figured out what these two currently living people are talking about.

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[–] Lucky_777@lemmy.world 9 points 5 hours ago

There wasn't even coffee in the nebula

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