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Correct.
Palestine should be allowed to exist without needing a Star Wars level rebel terrorist group to rage against Israel's cruelty.
Fuck Hamas, but they only exist because of Israel.
Now the only question is if we can get that genie back in the bottle if we correct our mistake, stop funding Israel, and let them fade away into dust.
Changing the guards of a prison, doesn't make it less a prison. There needs to be economic trade, economic development, a path to prosperity for people to believe in so they stop investing in the past.
As long as Gaza is entirely surrounded by Israel or countries doing Israels bidding, it will remain a prison, unless Israel goes through serious reform and atops being a brutal opressive regime.
For that to happen all illegal settlements would need to be dismantled though.
Or we need the formation af a new state that includes all territories, gives equal rights to arabs and jews and returns as much land as possible to displaced palestinians as well as compensates them properly. Also all terrirorists, that means also all settler terrorists need to be tried and convicted for their atrocities. For that i think it would be best do these trials at the ICC and provide prison facilities in Europe for the pre trial and post trial imprisonment of terrorists.
If Palestinians are given a real perspective and some justice i think it could work out. It would require the current terrorists and corrupt criminals in both governments to be removed from power though. So Bibi and Abbas will fight it tooth and nails.
As an intermediate step we would probably need a new UN mandate and lots of pressure to make Israels apartheid government step down.
100%. A upvote is simply not enough!
As long as Gaza is entirely surrounded by Israel or countries doing Israels bidding, it will remain a prison, unless Israel goes through serious reform and atops being a brutal opressive regime.
This is only true if you agree with the opposite as well: As long as Israel is entirely surrounded by Arab League or countries doing their bidding, it will remain a fortress under siege, unless the Arab world goes through serious reform and atops being brutal opressive regimes.
Otherwise, you're a hypocrite.
You do realize that Israel has access to the Mediterranian and Egypt is factually an ally of Israel since decades now? Also Israel has functional airports. Israel has free access to move goods by air, sea and partially by land and for people to travel by air, land and sea. I find Israeli products in supermarkets in Europe, from household appliances to produce.
I fail to see, what point you are trying to make. The situation in Israel is nothing like the situation in Gaza.
Ah yes Egypt, Israel's best friend! Just like Pakistan and India, Greece and Turkey or Argentina and UK. Just because they signed a peace deal, it doesn't mean they are allies. The following day, after the Hamas attacks, an Egyptian police officer shot at Israeli tourists in Alexandria and killed two Israelis and their Egyptian guide. Anti-Semitism is rife in the region.
Just because Israelis can fly or use the ports, doesn't mean that they are not under constant dread - my analysis still stands.
The day Israel declared independence Egypt, Syria, Transjordan, Iraq, Lebanon, Saudi Arabia, Yemen and volunteer corps from the Arab League ("Holy war army" and "Arab libertarian army" which had an insignia of the star of David with a dagger piercing it) attacked. This was fresh after Palestinian leaders met with Hitler in 1941 and the holocaust. They also saw that all the other neighbouring countries that declared independence in the region, including the ones from historical Palestine who took land from the Palestinian people, like Lebanon, Syria and Transjordan never got attacked or criticised. From Israel's point of view it was because they are Jews and the Arabs want another holocaust.
I would love to see the settlements in the West Bank dissolved, but it will never happen while the Arab (and Persian) world is still very much antisemitic and wants all the Israelis dead or "gone". The West Bank and Golan Heights offer strategic depth and security to Israel, and they will never leave. And they are willing to become the next North Korea if they have to, but at least they will be alive.
Now you don't have to agree with any of this. But those are "facts" for the Israelis. For them it's an existential crisis. The only way to reform Israel is also to reform the Arab world. Otherwise it's just a race to the bottom - both sides will elect more and more extremists.
Yeah, but you shouldn't release people before they're re-socialized either. Gaza needs an occupying force for the same reason my home country needed one in 1945: Way too many fascist in the population.
Some some survey data:
And of course there's the fact that 2013 at least 59% of Palestinians were in favor of executing apostates (i.e. murdering people who cease to be Muslim).
That said, of course there needs to be a positive economic development. Just like there was in Germany under occupation.
That's idea I guess: why take the responsability if not to make changes? Would be senseless otherwise.
Seems like theyre starting to go in a sane direction
Fuckin A man.
It should've been Egypt, but they don't want to.
I don't think they have the capabilities is my guess. It's understandable they don't want to, it's gonna be dangerous af. Politically speaking a UN Occupation and Peace Force would be the best way forward. Best from a country that is far away. China is not a bad contender. They have the resources and could gain valuable trade posts as well as prove their value as a world power they so desperately want to be. Philippines might also not be a bad choice they already have experience in UN Missions in Africa. Other choices could be a lot of states that have no geographical connection and don't belong to the "west" to avoid it seeming like some (post) imperialistic occupation.
Israel would probably be fine with Egypt but there's not much love left between Egyptians and Palestinians, and Egypt has its own shit to deal with in more than one way. The US is problematic for the same kind of reason: Palestinian distrust.
What could actually work is Germany, or more generally speaking a EU contingent under German command: Europe provides just over 50% of the total aid to Palestine and Palestinians know that, 20% from Arab countries, 11% from the US. (Providing aid to Palestinians is our favourite way to tell Israel's right wing to fucking cut it out).
All that hinges on Netanyahu and his Kahanites getting ousted, though, there can't be anything benefitting a peace process while von Papen and his fascists are in power as their power depends on conflict. Poll-wise it's looking good.
What could actually work is Germany, or more generally speaking a EU contingent under German command
Why would Germany and the EU ever agree to this? What they get is an impossible mission in a deeply troubled area and all the blame for every ill that will ever befall it in the future.
European Forces occupying the middle east gives of hard imperialistic taste. Also seeing how the EU and Germany are so close to the US militarily this could just be seen again as a western power struggle where US proxies are put in place. No what is needed is a country that is non aligned to neither the west nor the middle east.
Whoever administers the Gaza strip, has to be neutral, or at least acceptable to the government of Israel. Egypt has a complex history with the government of Israel, and Israel probably doesn't want Egyptian listening posts inside of their territory.
Egypt warned Israel about this attack. Egypt is not an enemy of Israel and hasn't been for a long time. Also >inside of their territory. Since when is Gaza part of Israel's territory?? Pretty biased language there.
At least Egypt doesn't officially deny the Israel's right to exist. That's good enough.
Not really good enough.
Inside of the borders of Israel, they are going to have security concerns, and they are not going to want foreign militaries to collect intelligence, to base weapons, to put them in a strategic disadvantage.
If the UN is going to police the area, there's going to be a long negotiation with Israel to determine which countries they find "acceptable" to be the peacekeeping force.
Maybe a joint international task group, UN backed?
Either that or Portugal
Very true. Fortunately, that is what Israel is also espousing. They don't want to rule it after the war. That's good. Not much else that they're doing is good, but that is.
Hamas, however, sure does want to rule it after the war.
Hamas needs to be removed like a tumor, if the world doesn't want Israel to do it, then another Arab nation or world coalition needs to go in and deal with them. They can't be allowed to stay. The only way any positive can come is if both nations get new, younger leaders who want to coexist
Those Arab nations are largely supportive of Hamas. More because they are anti-Israel than they are pro-Hamas.
Those Arab nations also hate and look down on Palestinians, so their fake support for Palestine is more about being anti Israel like you said.
Hamas needs to be removed, yes, but they're not a tumor; they're a virus. To quote Bassem Youssef, you don't cure a virus by hitting the patient with a sledgehammer.
I believe the israeli political leadership said they will have no responsibility for it. They did not say they won't have control over it. I fully expect them to continue the embargo forever. But just say they're not responsible for the suffering inside due to the embargo.
This is assuming they don't find some way to completely ethnically cleanse Gaza strip in the next month or two
They don't want to rule it after the war.
They are military occupying it, though, and are considering doing more than that.