Fediverse memes

echoed quite a bit of what I’ve been saying about .ml, the Triad, general toxicity of their Tankie “ideology” for months now.

Sorry, how is his post at all about the 'triad'?

Frankly, I think it's the constant attempts at instigating flame wars that I find to be so grating, not the users with opinions I find distasteful. I have no idea what ptz's specific experience was like, but seeing a prominent anti-tanky crusader project their personal vendetta onto this announcement is the kind of shit I find myself constantly rolling my eyes at.

Federated social media is built to facilitate community between people of different preferences, and it's exactly this constant crusading that's likely to extinguish it. You think you're on a mission of purification but it looks more like you're extinguishing what little enthusiasm there was for lemmy to begin with. Defederation is absolutely a tool for moderation, but making it your entire mission to push for it in every space you participate in is itself a suffocating cancer.

Let people decide for themselves what instances they want to commune with and stop pestering the entire platform into reflecting your personal tastes.

Now I would really like to make a deepdive and see how did blackskyweb.xyz manage to become huge moderating force in AT proto(bluesky).

I was surprised that over those 2 years bluesky is kinda selfhostable. Maybe decision to make instances more important than people has doomed ActivityPub to become a toxic cesspool. I still remember how technology connections has resigned from mastodon over toxicity.

I saw this toxicity at the beginning and changed how I interact with the network. No controversial topics whatsoever, no OC memes as they will be bashed. Now I just repost stuff from tumblr and comment here and there.

Just the amount of self reflection i'd expect from you. You are a toxic bully yourself.

Honestly, I got banned from that instance after down voting several posts I disagreed with, which is what down vote is there for, and dude told me to fuck off in the notice like I was running a script or something. I don't personally care, but I also have zero sympathy for someone on the internet being that sensitive or heavy handed. Probably didn't deserve whatever toxic nonsense they'd been exposed to, but still, based on my interactions with em, good riddance.

It was a rather sombering thread, that echoed quite a bit of what I've been saying about .ml, the Triad, general toxicity of their Tankie "ideology" for months now.

A lot of what Patrick is referring to goes well beyond the 'tankie triad' (two of which are banned from most instances anyway).

Hell, I saw hex users fucking cheering .ee's shutdown because it was some sort of psyop/CIA/fed/lib/"They didn't perfectly agree with me" instance. They call feddit.org a "Nazi Zionist" instance for the crime....of not wanting to be arrested and complying with German law...

And yet all that happened was with lemm.ee shutting down, hexbear became more isolated because lemm.ee actually federated with them.

Outside of .ml, most tankies are despised across the fediverse.

If anyone thinks this is turning into 4chan or even worse, voat, you seriously have not experienced either of those.

I usually don’t get bothered by people on the Internet, but holy fucking shit how I was absolutely going crazy over the fact that people unironically shill North Korea.

I'm Korean. We are under constant threat of shit balloons and missiles. They punish people and their family members for trying to leave the country. How can one possibly look at that and say, "Yep, that's fine"?

The dubvee shutdown posts makes some valid point, but I disagree on a few others.

The communities I'm in are mostly safe from toxic users

• !movies@piefed.social
• !casualconversation@piefed.social
• !wholesome@reddthat.com
• !lego@piefed.social
• !football@sopuli.xyz

I avoid news and politics, that probably helps a lot on that regard

This might be a call for mods to keep an eye on reports, and for users to post and comment on well moderated community. !fedigrow@lemmy.zip can help.

It's sad to see Admiral Patrick go, but it's not all doom and gloom.

Reddit keeps enshittifying (DM shutdown, UK age verification), we might see new people come here soon.

Unfortunately I think some of this perception is an example of the echo chamber problem of social media.

If you're in the politics and news echo chambers you see horrendous toxicity all the time. But if you're in hobby groups and interest groups that have nothing to do with politics it's generally not toxic in my experience.

I'm in both and there are loads of positive and kind communities and people around. I fear the moderators in particular have an understandably skewed view as they have to trudge through the toxic shit every day and protect a lot of the rest of us from it.

I think there is something to be said for more defederation of entire instances where toxic cuktures are allowed to thrive, even if they also happen to host more positive communities too. Those communities need to move and the priority for the Threadiverse tech needs to be enabling movement of communities as easily and painlessly as possible so the toxic areas can be left to fester on their own.

I'll repeat a few things I've been saying about this. To keep it ~~short:~~ less verbose:

What people call "toxicity" online relies heavily on irrationality, from the aggressor and/or the target. And politics raises the stakes of everything, so irrationality + political engagement is specially prone to generate catty behaviour, name calling, uncalled combativeness, and all that crap.

Now look at social media. You'll see irrationals infesting every platform. Reddit in special encourages it, and most lemmings are from Reddit.

Why this matters: because I believe people here are focusing too much on .ml and Hexbear, without noticing the problem would still persist without them.

I think it is worth differentiating between dubvee and lemm.ee on this topic. Dubvee seems to have been shut down mostly for personal reasons, and IMHO if the timing would have not overlapped with the lemm.ee shut down people would just consider it part of the normal churn of smaller instances coming and going.

On the other hand, lemm.ee was a bit of a special case. From the very beginning they invited a lot of "defederation is bad" type of people to their instance and were also one of the few larger instances that decided to keep federating with hexbear despite having first hand experience with their toxicity. So to a large extend they set themselves up to alot of drama 🤷 In addition their technical setup was probably a bit overengineered, adding to the admin workload.

As an instance admin myself, I can't say that things are overly stressful if you defederate the right instances and quickly ban alts of known troublemakers.

However, I agree that the feddit.org witchhunt was very toxic, and as a moderator of /c/europe@feddit.org I was also directly targeted. But it was clearly a very small number of people that instigated most of it. Discounting alts and throwaways it was probably a single digit number of people doing 95% of the harm.

The first time I found out that dubvee existed was when they banned me from all of their communities. And it sounds like they're just being soft skinned instead of just defederating the tankie instances. I'd argue having tankie instances is a good thing. It keeps them contained and easy to block.