this post was submitted on 11 Apr 2025
1061 points (99.5% liked)

Science Memes

14681 readers
2158 users here now

Welcome to c/science_memes @ Mander.xyz!

A place for majestic STEMLORD peacocking, as well as memes about the realities of working in a lab.



Rules

  1. Don't throw mud. Behave like an intellectual and remember the human.
  2. Keep it rooted (on topic).
  3. No spam.
  4. Infographics welcome, get schooled.

This is a science community. We use the Dawkins definition of meme.



Research Committee

Other Mander Communities

Science and Research

Biology and Life Sciences

Physical Sciences

Humanities and Social Sciences

Practical and Applied Sciences

Memes

Miscellaneous

founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 151 points 1 month ago (3 children)

This is also why hunting vests are bright orange. Easy for humans to spot, and deer get confused by there being a fucking tiger loose in New England.

[–] Lyrl@lemm.ee 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Apparently pink works as well, if a hunter wants a second color vest

[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 12 points 1 month ago

That works on the same principle, except the deer thinks you're a panther.

[–] Deepus@lemm.ee 12 points 1 month ago

I always wondered about that, thanks.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] VivianRixia@piefed.social 86 points 1 month ago (7 children)

So was it just random that their fur is orange and not green? As both would help hunt prey just as well. Or is the advantage of being orange, that it wards away other tigers and predators that might otherwise muscle into its territory and create conflict.

[–] Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone 178 points 1 month ago (7 children)

It’s also orange because mammals can’t produce green pigments, so orange is the next best thing if your prey is red-green colorblind.

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 103 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

Our primary outer protein is basically keratin, which can be tinted orange(carotene), beige (collagen) or brown/black (melanin).

The green pigment is a byproduct of bilirubin catabolism, which we don't have because we use a different pathway to metabolize and recycle it.

[–] floofloof@lemmy.ca 48 points 1 month ago (1 children)
[–] Dicska@lemmy.world 15 points 1 month ago (1 children)
load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] Umbrias@beehaw.org 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)

more accurately, orange pigments are readily available. Nothing fundamentally stops mammals (or anything else) from developing a green. Note for example many animals have green eyes.

[–] Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 1 month ago (2 children)

From what I understand green eyes are a bit weird as far as coloration goes, as they look green due to the way light is interacting with small amounts of melanin in the iris (the same pigment that makes eyes brown) rather than due to green pigment. I’m not sure that could be replicated in fur vs in a liquid environment like with the eye.

Birds mimic green colored pigments with iridescence (except turacos, they have green pigments for real) in their feathers, but I’m not sure that’s something mammals can do structurally in fur the way birds can in feathers.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] NarrativeBear@lemmy.world 34 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

This is probably an example of natural evolution/selection where tigers that had slowly evolved more orange in their fur naturally, were able to feed more. This in turn meant the orange triat in their genes was passed on more frequently and became more dominant in the population.

In a sense it was probably a "random" mutation, but when it became useful and effective it was passed down quicker.

[–] GregorGizeh@lemmy.zip 27 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This is how evolution works. People often imagine some sort of logical system to it, but it really is just random mutations all over, with the advantageous ones propagating. There were probably a bunch of tigers with various odd colors or patterns at some point due to random mutations, but those evidently were less useful for hunting and reproducing than how they look now, so they died out in competition with the known variants.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (2 replies)
[–] pelespirit@sh.itjust.works 14 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Are there any green animals that aren't reptiles, birds or insects? That might be a clue.

load more comments (4 replies)
[–] Khanzarate@lemmy.world 10 points 1 month ago

Yellows and browns and orange are a lot more related, and whatever color the pre-orange tiger ancestor was, it was almost certainly one of those.

Natural variation in the coat means some of those tigers were more orange than their peers. This trait was selected for.

[–] dnick@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Probably both, except within the bounds of easily 'random' bounds. Supposing it were possible for a mammal to be green, it wouldn't matter of green were 'better', unless it happened at the right time. Orange could have won out simply because it was good enough to do one thing (camoflauge for pretty) and didn't have enough downside to message that benefit (high visibility to hunters or less valuable prey). Heck, a gene that turned a lion invisible could have turned up and it wouldn't be guaranteed to carry forward even if it didn't have any downsides if the random recipient also happened to be clumsy or unlucky and died of some random injury or disease.

Evolution doesn't really have any tools that aren't random, at least until intelligence came around to provide other 'non natural' paths, though of course those are just as natural as the others, just that we think we're special and above nature.

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] bonsai@lemmy.dbzer0.com 79 points 1 month ago

Meanwhile my colorblind ass:

[–] goodwipe@lemmy.ca 45 points 1 month ago (2 children)

The green image of the tiger is terrifying. You wouldn't see it until it's eyes or teeth were baring down on you in a lush green forest. Thankfully humans weren't it's main prey and therefore it likely evolved to appear orange instead...

[–] InverseParallax@lemmy.world 41 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

Umm, I've met tigers.

You need to explain to them that we're not prey, but they haven't figured it out yet.

[–] tja@sh.itjust.works 22 points 1 month ago

I think the key word is "main".

[–] humanspiral@lemmy.ca 14 points 1 month ago

fish are friends not food.

[–] JillyB@beehaw.org 25 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I'm colorblind and the images are nearly identical. Good thing I'm not in tiger habitats very often.

[–] vithigar@lemmy.ca 11 points 1 month ago

Same. Didn't even realise they were different images until after I read the text.

[–] chonglibloodsport@lemmy.world 38 points 1 month ago

Tigers are generally crepuscular which means they’re most active around dawn or dusk, when the sun is very low in the sky. Their orange fur does not stand out so well when everything looks orange under the golden light of dawn.

[–] JimVanDeventer@lemmy.world 35 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Thank you, evolution, for allowing me to see orange so I can get an head start and outrun a mother fucking tiger!

[–] jwt@programming.dev 28 points 1 month ago (3 children)

outrun a mother fucking tiger

You only need to outrun your travelbuddy.

load more comments (3 replies)
[–] Acamon@lemmy.world 32 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Is that why cats can be so ginger and still good hunters? My orange stands out so much in the garden, but maybe to dichromatic mice he's super stealthy?

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] jeena@piefed.jeena.net 27 points 1 month ago (10 children)

Wouldn't a mutation in the deer sight to see orange be vastly evolutionary beneficial?

Only in areas with tigers, and then it would only express itself enough if there were enough evolutionary pressure exclusively on that survival tactic.

As long as other causes of death happen to deer in tiger territories and as long as speed remains a good survival strategy, minor mutations that would only provide an advantage in extreme specific scenarios like a tiger stalking them wouldn't have a chance to be spread.

There's also a whole host of additional brain power that needs to be dedicated to more complex colour blending and processing, and that may add enough delay to offset any potential gain in recognizing a threat.

[–] Xatolos@reddthat.com 11 points 1 month ago

It could, but it might also lead to something harmful for the deer at the same time. I'm not sure if the gene affecting the deer's eyesight is known, but it could be a pleiotropic gene (a gene that influences multiple traits at once).

If that's the case, and the other effect is negative and somehow spreads through the population, it could become a future issue for the deer. Think about humansβ€”we lost the ability to produce our own vitamin C. Almost every other mammal can produce their own (except for hamsters). When this happened, it didn’t harm us right away, so it spread through the population. But over time, it led to issues that weren’t a problem before, like scurvy.

Same could happen to the deer.

[–] apotheotic@beehaw.org 11 points 1 month ago

Presumably yes, but its still down to a roll of the dice whether a mutation like that happens in the first place, and whether the individuals who have that mutation live long enough to breed, and whether that mutation actually gets passed down, etc

load more comments (7 replies)
[–] Agent641@lemmy.world 21 points 1 month ago (3 children)

Do the tigers know they are orange?

[–] TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world 23 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Do humans know tigers are green?

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] lugal@sopuli.xyz 12 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

No, they too are dichromats

[–] MyNameIsAtticus@lemmy.world 19 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Desperately need me a community just for tiger facts like this and pictures of tigers. Greatest of the Big Cats

[–] Hikermick@lemmy.world 10 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Thank you for subscribing to Big Cat Facts

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (3 replies)
[–] MECHAGODZILLA2@midwest.social 14 points 1 month ago

Oooh I just thought nature was fucking stupid

[–] Toes@ani.social 11 points 1 month ago

Almost like our eyes evolved to give danger its own colour.

[–] Churbleyimyam@lemm.ee 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

This must be utterly terrifying for them.

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] REDACTED 9 points 1 month ago (2 children)

Would not green be the obvious route then?

[–] FooBarrington@lemmy.world 15 points 1 month ago

AFAIK green is more expensive to produce. Plants use it since it's good at absorbing sunlight, but what's the advantage to a tiger, if their prey can't tell the difference?

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments
view more: next β€Ί